I’m confused?

On the WI/MN Border Waters….

A One Man Daily Limit of Twenty Five 15 Pound Flatheads. = 375 pounds of fish

Assuming 2/3 ‘s of this weight is head, skin, bone and organs 375 / 3 = 125 pounds of flesh.

From WI Fish Consumption Advisory

Women up to age 50 (child bearing age) and children (under age 15) may safely eat: 1 Meal Per Month

All men (15 and older) and older women (50 and older) may safely eat:

1 Meal Per Month

The above advice is due to the following pollutants: mercury, pcb, pfos

Date of Query: August 08 2013 WI Fish Consumption Advisory.

The USDA recommends we eat 3 to 4 ounces of fish as part of a healthy meal. About the size of a deck of cards.

Let’s just up that to 1 pound for dinner, feeding a family of 6.

That would mean a one man, one day limit would feed a family of 6 for over 20 months?

Using the same formula of 2/3rds waste and 1/3 flesh, a 30 pound flathead would give up 10 pounds for the dinner table.

I ‘spose a person could freeze it, right?

With all the talk about Asian Carp moving into our waters, I would think the DNR’s from both MN and WI would want to protect these natural Asian Carp Barriers? There’s no cost involved.

Buzz? Wouldn’t Anglers for Habitat support lower limits on our Rivers to protect the Apex Predator of the Mississippi? It’s one more bullet to keep the AC from coming up this way.

is there a decline in flathead numbers? honest question not . I have thought to be blessed with a good to better than most flathead fishing on pool 4.ive only fished flats for 5 years. I do keep a few to eat.(usually smaller 2-10# fish) never even close to the limit. Is there a high number of guys keeping big numbers of these? Was there better fishing in recent past?

Looking at it from the AC perspective, does it matter?
Each one will eat 1/3 it’s weight in a 24 hour period. That does include Asian Carp.

Looking at the limit from a consumption perspective…does it matter?

The law says 25 flatheads is the limit. The advisory says one meal a month.

Even if no one took 25 flats home, what is this statement saying?

We are ready to spend millions if not billions of taxpayer $$$ to prevent AC from coming up steam, but we won’t take the time to change a limit?

Back to confused.

BK it sounds like you have a good idea here but in my opinion suppressing the invasion in a natural way may have consequences as well. Say you suppress the invasion and the catfish population increases significantly, doesn’t it make the catfish population susceptible to a major crash?

Don’t get me wrong, a natural solution sounds great to me as well, but it may have some unintended consequences as well.

It does seem like a better option though.

“Lower limits on our Rivers”, They did just that on the St. Louis river. The limit on walleye was 6 twenty some years ago, now it is two. The reason was to “Eat more goby fish” I wonder if it worked??

Do you honestly think that lowering the limit on catfish will have an effect on the asian carp population??? Really?? Lots of catfish down south. Lots of asian carp too.

I did hear that flathead catfish are excellent tablefare when smoked.

By that same logic… Beer should only be sold two at a time.

Such an excessive limit has no purpose. It made someone feel better to have a number in a chart so they made one up. The problem is that it looks like management.

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Do you honestly think that lowering the limit on catfish will have an effect on the asian carp population??? Really??

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Are you asking if I think a >expensive< barrier at the Ford dam will have an effect on the asian carp population? When they can still go up the MN River?

Just one moment. I have to read your question again.

They eat anything including AC. It’s free…and that might be the only problem.

Bill, I’m certainly not a biologist, but I play one on the internet at times.

I believe the flats would get larger. Seldom from what the biologist tell me can we have more AND bigger fish in the system. It’s one or the other.

With carp for example. If a person nets all the carp out of a lake, they come back as more but smaller fish.

Reducing the “limit” to 10 won’t change a thing in the river (if no one is taking home 25 fish now as some say).

It will show responsibility in lowering the excessive limits that are now in place. I mean really? At the suggested consumption rate of one meal per month, how many does a person need to feed a large family??

This –

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On a side note, will the Asian Carp survive here? I know there are samples being caught on occasion but just slightly more often than a blue cat.

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Hey (not directed at you Chris), if politicians, biologists and researchers can use AC to scare people into dishing out money, can’t Brian use them to get limits lowered?

Thanks for your input Chris!

I can’t take credit for the AC “live” barrier. People smarter then me came up with that. Is it a silver bullet. No. But it can’t hurt.

Really, does it matter if you or I can or can not catch 25 flats in a day? 50 in possession?

It’s excessive. I think we all agree on that.

When was this limit enacted? It seems like a lot of the catfish regulations in some areas are relegated to the past, before people realized that they weren’t ‘rough fish’. I see cat fishing becoming more and more popular these days, so with the added attention, the limit’s gotta change..

A one man daily limit of 25 fish? Thats excessive with no doubt about it. 25 fish? I’m guessing but our daily limit of flatheads is I think 10 or 12 and the same as channels, but 25? Id be wondering too. Like you said Brian I think that that law needs to be updated…I’ve often thought that both flatheads and channels here are part of the reason the whitebass populations have dropped because were loaded with both but 25 flatheads a day? whats the possesion limit? It does sound excessive but I’m not a fisheries biologist eigther.

By gum if the Flathead Eating Machine Mossy says it’s excessive, you know it’s out of line!

50 is the possession limit (double the daily limit).

Trying to wrap my head around a mental image of 25 flats in one boat, and it just looks silly. Then tried to wrap my head around 2 guys in a boat with 50 flats and I saw the boat sinking. Problem solved

If the theory is that more larger flats would eat more AC then wouldn’t the same theory hold that more larger flats would eat more sunnies, crappies, bass, and our beloved and blessed walleye too?

I usually downsize my bait and catch my daily 25 limit just to throw em up on shore.

Is the 25 limit a WI reg? I just looked at the 2013 MN regs and it’s showing 10 flats a day for border waters.

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Is the 25 limit a WI reg? I just looked at the 2013 MN regs and it’s showing 10 flats a day for border waters.

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25 is with a WI license on border waters. 10 combined is with a MN license. That alone shows the discrepency between the MNDNR attitudes toward cats and the WIDNR’s.

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I usually downsize my bait and catch my daily 25 limit just to throw em up on shore.

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A great conversation…but all I thought when I saw “I’m confused” was, that’s gotta be BK!!!

As was said before, the only ones really affected by lowering the limits on cats would be the commercial fishermen.
I just cannot see pulling the commercial guys livelyhood away from them when the flathead population is in such good shape. This limit has been in effect for years with no ill effects on the cats.

My two cents.

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As was said before, the only ones really affected by lowering the limits on cats would be the commercial fishermen.
I just cannot see pulling the commercial guys livelyhood away from them when the flathead population is in such good shape. This limit has been in effect for years with no ill effects on the cats.

My two cents.

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I am pretty sure commercial fishermen are not held to the recreational angler’s limit…

I don’t know if the law even has to be changed, why? because who is going to catch 25 flatheads in a day anyway. Not to disagree with anyone but of all the guys I know here and a few on the site here, who actually is good enough to catch that many, I don’t know anyone who can, not even a good bite will produce 25 flatheads a day and 50 in 2 days with a fishing pole or even a limit of hooks on a trotline. And where does the 15 pound limit per fish come into play. Maybe its one of those laws that when heard of its shocking, when you’d think a more conservative limit number, which is much lower, would have been chosen.

Here’s a question, why did they originally set the limit at 25 fish, knowing that no sport fisherman would ever catch that many, did they back then want to decrease the flathead population or just throw a number into a hat? because back then there was no research. 50 flatheads for two days? thats like setting a limit of 100 bluegills a day.

Mossy, the 15 pounds was used as an example. There is no law that mentions weight.

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because who is going to catch 25 flatheads in a day anyway.

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First off, there are more walleyes in the river then flatheads. Let’s change the walleye limit to 25…they are a lot smaller.

So no one can catch 25 in a day. Then why is there a problem changing the law to match MN’s? Isn’t 10 Flats enough?

Currently, with no closed season, I will contend it’s easy to bring home 25 flats in a day…everyday. Wintering flats can be taken out and kept as legally caught fish because unless the CO actually sees them being snagged, there’s no way to prove in court they were snagged.

Again, with these responsible changes, the only people that will be affected are the…..

POACHERS.

I see where your coming from Brian and I agree. The 25 flats a day is hard to do in warm fishing conditions unlike winter but who’s going to catch 25 at one time anytime of year. Yes its possible to do it through the ice in winter, forgot about that, but in all reality whos going to catch that many. The 25 limit is just a number to me because the average joe isn’t going to catch that many. If theres a limited supply of flatheads for the surrounding population then Id say close the season during winter if theres a threat. Here theres no threat and thier only fished in warm months, no ones out on the river fishing flatheads in the winter.

I can see someone fishing a honey hole where flatheads winter over but the average joe isn’t going to do that. Is there that many guys there that fish those honey holes and take 25 a day, just wondering. I can see protecting a resource if theres an immediate or potential threat but is there? I don’t know, maybe theres some guys there that do fish wintering flatheads and do get those 25 flatheads a day, I’m trying to see it but I suspect there’s very few. I know theres meat hunters that would probably take advantage of that wintering spot but is there that many. Even fishing those wintering holes it hard for me to see anyone taking 25 flatheads a day, to me thats pretty darned lucky, even snagging them. You hear more of whats going on there so maybe its justified to close the season during winter.

Maybe one of the main reasons why its hard to change the law is because the DNR doesn’t want to be contested, maybe pride, maybe hassle. If its necessary to protect them then its like nesting ducks, protect them and close the season where their the most venerable.

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no ones out on the river fishing flatheads in the winter.

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LOL!

Then it again shouldn’t be an issue right?

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La Crosse County warden Russ Wilson, who cited a man for keeping flathead catfish he had deliberately snagged below the Genoa Lock and Dam.
“With the rig he was using he was able to set the hook as soon as it hit the bottom and he’d have a catfish on,” Wilson said. “Then it took him 35-40 minutes to get the fish up through the hole in the ice.”

This man was the only person cited, but several of his fishing companions were quick to gather around the man pulling up a catfish, shielding the poacher from most people, except Wilson.

Wilson said the poacher had 70 pounds of catfish when he was handed the citation.

Another angler had established a Web page suggesting to others who might be interested how to lower an underwater camera and snap catfish. Several DNR wardens contacted the man and warned him what could happen if someone kept fish that were foul-hooked. The problem disappeared.
“Most flathead catfish winter (sleep) in the Mississippi River,” said Ron Benjamin, DNR fish manager in La Crosse. “They are usually so lethargic that a layer of silt covers them.” ~
Written by Lacrosse Tribune

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I’ve learned to “grab” videos and photo’s of folks that have claimed to catch flatheads in the winter as soon as I see them. For some reason they seem to be removed from the public view shortly after being posted.

I believe it was two years ago there was a conveniently edited video of a fella fishing the MN River catching flats through the ice. Disappeared.

Mossy, if you think poachers are going to knock on your door to show you their catch…I have this ocean front property at Everts for sale.

Again, if “no one does it” the only people that will complain are the poachers….right?

Thanks for everyone’s input.

It helped with the presentation Coley Crawler and I gave at the WI Conservation Congress last evening. We met some very good folks there.

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no ones out on the river fishing flatheads in the winter.

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LOL!

Then it again shouldn’t be an issue right?

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La Crosse County warden Russ Wilson, who cited a man for keeping flathead catfish he had deliberately snagged below the Genoa Lock and Dam.
“With the rig he was using he was able to set the hook as soon as it hit the bottom and he’d have a catfish on,” Wilson said. “Then it took him 35-40 minutes to get the fish up through the hole in the ice.”

This man was the only person cited, but several of his fishing companions were quick to gather around the man pulling up a catfish, shielding the poacher from most people, except Wilson.

Wilson said the poacher had 70 pounds of catfish when he was handed the citation.

Another angler had established a Web page suggesting to others who might be interested how to lower an underwater camera and snap catfish. Several DNR wardens contacted the man and warned him what could happen if someone kept fish that were foul-hooked. The problem disappeared.
“Most flathead catfish winter (sleep) in the Mississippi River,” said Ron Benjamin, DNR fish manager in La Crosse. “They are usually so lethargic that a layer of silt covers them.” ~
Written by Lacrosse Tribune

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I’ve learned to “grab” videos and photo’s of folks that have claimed to catch flatheads in the winter as soon as I see them. For some reason they seem to be removed from the public view shortly after being posted.

I believe it was two years ago there was a conveniently edited video of a fella fishing the MN River catching flats through the ice. Disappeared.

Mossy, if you think poachers are going to knock on your door to show you their catch…I have this ocean front property at Everts for sale.

Again, if “no one does it” the only people that will complain are the poachers….right?

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I think you are painting people with an awful broad brush by insinuating anyone who thinks differently than you is a poacher Brian. This very much offends me.

If you do not want other opinions do not ask. From your position it obviously is hard to see the unbiased opinions of others.

I am done with this discussion.

I’m sorry I can’t help your offended by my opinion Lenny.

I don’t call people poachers for offering up opinions. I call poachers…well poachers.

Again I see where your coming from Brian. I agree that you’ve done your homework by keeping track of these violations that some have done.

When I referred to the 25 fish limit and possession limit of 50 for two days I simply seen it as very hard to achieve, thats all and it seems it is and thats why I refered to it as a number just thrown into a hat, why not pick 50 or 60 fish as a limit as example, that makes as much sense as a 25 fish limit. A limit like that seems out of place to begin with, why not a 12 fish possession limit. Maybe they should have thought a little more and set it at an 8 to 12 fish limit, that’s why I said a 25 fish limit would be hard to achieve for anyone, simply that and the way it was written.

Sometimes its hard to explain whats really on your mind and the way its meant via typing where you can’t hear the person talking, atleast were concerned about flatheads and the outrageous limits that are on the books. 25 flatheads, hell they might as well said 50 and it borders throwing them on the bank.

Down here where the state fish should be the catfish its only a 10 or 12 fish limit, thats why I was so shocked at seeing a 25 fish limit on flatheads and anyone legally fishing flatheads, thats knows his salt, knows a 25 fish limit is almost impossible to attain. I’m sure that back when that limit was set, catfish in general was looked at more as a borderline trash fish, much like the bullhead is now.

If we were discussing the subject in person it would be a done deal in 60 seconds because we would be able to explain what we meant better, but because typing doesn’t do the job, were trying to get across what we mean, done deal.

Do I think that limit ought to be changed, heck yes, to a more reasonable number so people like me won’t be so shocked, the old ticker just might give out seeing numbers like that.

Should there be seasons or limit waters and areas, yes, where there’s a good chance that they can be abused like in those honey holes of deep water pockets like below the dams there and underneath anything that breaks the current flow.

I look back and think about the things I’ve said and the amount of fish I’ve caught and maybe its made the impression that I’m strictly a meat hunter. I do try to put fish in the freezer for winter and I usually have close to enough for that reason. I’m also a person that knows limits benefit everyone and sometimes, often enough, The guys I go with and myself limit out, again fish for the freezer and for friends who eigther don’t know how to or physically can’t go to the river. I stick within limits and when we do limit out, here, and over the years we haven’t seen any drop what so ever if the numbers of fish we catch, and believe me we hammer them when conditions are right, heck they don’t even have to be that good, just good enough.

You and the other readers don’t have to worry about anyone here abusing the flathead resource because we have alot of them here and this river, believe it or not is relatively unfished when taking skill into consideration. A 25 flathead fish limit? that needs to be changed.