Bullheads and Cheeseheads

Can you WI residents use bullheads over 7 inches for bait or are you, like us Minnesotans, required to use only those bullys under 7 inches. Also, does anyone know the “philosophy” or rational our MN DNR uses requiring bullys to be under 7 inches? Or is it just another law that make no sense but we have to follow? Suckers and chubs-doesn’t matter, they can be any length.

Not aware of any size limitations here. The only rationale I can think of for it is that they’re giving a nod to the bullhead fishery. They’re seeing bulls over 7 as sport fish, without actually trying to call them sportfish. I know bullhead fishing is quite popular in both states where it is good – but the limits on bullheads don’t suggest that the DNRs are too active in managing those populations. That would be a pain in the arse law, though. I’ve never measured the bulls I use, but right around 7 or 8 inches would have to be about prime. Can’t imagine catters having too much of an impact on the “trophy bullhead” fishery.

There are no size limits in Wisconsin but you can only use the large bullys on the WI side of the channel or WI inland waters. You cannot use bullheads over 7 inches on the Minnesota side of the Mississippi even if you carry a WI license.

These are the same bounardy limitations as are in place for using sunfish for bait and for using three rods.

Gator Hunter

Dumb question expecting a dumb answer.

If the limit is 100 bullheads, what’s the differance if you use them for bait or eat them…as long as you don’t have more than 100. Forget about the size ( )

OK…now to the “philosophy” part….does anyone have a MN DNR contact..either telephone or e-mail where I can get a explanation as to why this law exists?

Thanks for the info guys.

How about this…if bullheads under 7 inches are “minnows”,
is there a 100 limit on them?

I certainly wouldn’t speak for the makers of the law, and can’t say I understand it, even. But it looks to me as if the belief is that bullheads over 7 inches are food fish – people catch them to eat – and the Minnesota DNR is taking the stance that using fish for food is more legitimate than using them for bait. Again, not that I have any idea that this is their thinking, nor would I agree.

Can you guys point me to the pages in the WI regs that state a WI angler can only use big bullheads on the WI side of the river? Thanks

Flathead WI, just be thankful your a WI resident…I not only have to catch large quantities of bullheads, but have to measure many of them to boot…it is a PAIN!!! Sometimes very literally a PAIN!!! Ouch!!

I couldn’t find it, the only thing i saw that was relevant to this thread was the part that says :

“You must obey the regulations of the state in which you are fishing”

If that means anything..??

Slop Bass….the MN and WI DNR even disagree about this. WI says with a WI out of state Lic..you can follow the WI rules if you’re fishing the WI side…MN says there is NO side and if you are a MN resedent you must follow the MN reges period.

Dirk…You are a calm level headed guy…but you are about to get frustrated…..Here you go and…good luck!

[email protected]

Or if you’re in a hurry to pull your hair out….651-296-6157.

I may sound like I don’t care for the DNR, which is not the case. It’s just very frustrating because it is so hard to find out the “why’s” behind some rules. I’m sure it’s not just MN and WI.

Leave it to Catdad to muddy thing up even worse . I know one game warden who thinks that bullheads must be seven inches . Will do further research on the subject……

Chris, you are so right on trying to find real information and not the interpretations.

My thought would be that if you use a bull over 7 inches when it not considered a minnow anymore…it becomes a game fish and you aren’t allowed to use game fish for bait in MN…

But then again your in violation if you through fish parts in any waters…what do you do with the left over cutbait? Pickle it?

Wait a minute…what is cut bait? Now i’m going to have to look that up too. You can’t use fish parts….for bait….

I can see it coming $250 for a fishing licanse…comes complete with a Palm Pilot for slots and speacial regulations…it’s going to happen!

I once emailed that exact question to the Minnesota D&R and the good folks up there decided that an answer was not warranted.

Dirk – I sent an e-mail to the DNR back on 10 March 2004 when I was inquiring about catching bait from the St Croix. I specifically asked him if bullheads were legal to use for bait and this is his respnse. This reply was received from a Mr Roy Johannes. His e-mail is [email protected]

From: Roy Johannes [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 12:16 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: Jim Abernathy
Subject: Re: Legal questions regarding catching bait for personal use?

Dear Steve:

Thank you for your inquiry taking minnows and the St. Croix River. The first question you have about taking bait in the St. Croix River is that the river is closed to the taking of minnows and bait from Taylors Falls to the confluence of the Mississippi River.

We receive questions about cast nets all of the time and they are not legal for use in Minnesota.

In regards to the bullhead question, bullheads seven inches and under may be used as bait for angling.

Let me know if you have additional questions.

Sincerely,

Roy J. Johannes
Commercial Fisheries Program Consultant
Phone 651-296-2308
Fax 651-297-4916
e-mail: [email protected]

Dirk – This is a link to the Wisconsin 2004 – 2005 Spearing and Netting Regulations. It covers the trapping and netting of minnows. What you are looking for may be in this regulation: http://dnr.wi.gov/org/water/fhp/fish/regulations/2004/documents/spearing04.pdf

This next link is to the Wisconsin DNR Frequently Asked Questions page. It has an excellent search capability: http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/water/fhp/fish/faq/index.shtml#faq_equipment

Hope these help

Steve

Brian – In response to your question about cutbait leftovers. In Wisconsin and Minnesota their regulations both specifically state that you cannot discard fish parts into the water. The way I interpret the regulations you can use cut bait provided that the parts not used are collected and placed in the trash and not thrown into the water. In Wisconsin it is illegal to chum because you cannot discard fish parts or other garbage into the water. You can put chopped up fish parts in a mesh bag and hang that in the water provided when you are done fishing you retrieve the mesh bag and discard the fish parts into the trash.

Bullheads are considered a rough fish, as are suckers and redhorses, but the suckers and reds have no length requirement….makes sense to me

Mr. Comanchero15
you have a wealth of info!

All very interesting and informative.
I did read some statutes that buddies who run a bait shop had.It did state that bullies under 7″ are considered minnow and may be used for live bait.Not to sure about bullheads being rough fish though.I thought they were considered game fish if over 7″.Why else would you be not able to use them if over 7″?
I also beleive I read that suckers over 12″ may not be used as bait?
I would ask the DNR to email you the complete fishing regulations.The handbook we get when we get licensed is only a summary of the rules.There is a very thick document spelling everything out.
I also don’t beleive that that covers everything.Ther are a lot of rules that are too easily interpreted differently by different people.
Any way I don’t measure every bullies but I do my best to keep it within reason.
I might however start!

Page 52 – 2003 MN Fishing Regulations Handbook

“Rough fish are defined as carp, buffalo, sucker, redhorse, freshwater drum (sheepshead), bowfin (dogfish), burbot (eelpout), cisco (tillibee), gar, mooneye, and bullhead”.

This was taken from the “rough fish spearing, archery, and dip nets” section”.

When the warden looked at my 17 inch redhorses those he said were fine – no problem. It was the 7 1/4 inch bullhead that got me my written warning .

Subd. 43. Rough fish. “Rough fish” means carp,
buffalo, sucker, sheepshead, bowfin, burbot, cisco, gar,
goldeye, and bullhead.

Subd. 29. Minnows. “Minnows” means: (1) members of
the minnow family, Cyprinidae, except carp and goldfish; (2)
members of the mudminnow family, Umbridae; (3) members of the
sucker family, Catostomidae, not over 12 inches in length; (4)
bullheads, ciscoes, lake whitefish, goldeyes, and mooneyes, not
over seven inches long; and (5) leeches.

Dirk,

I think if I had been you, and gotten a ticket instead of a warning, I would go to court and tell the good judge that they are attempting to enforce a law nobody can find. Nothing like headlines to make bureaucrats nervous. I would also have asked the warden if he could show you in the regs where it says you can’t because I read them cover to cover and it never says thou shalt not put large bullys in harms way.

It also seems that if you want to eat a sucker, which some people do, they must be UNDER 12 inches???? Were’s the icon with me scratching me pulling my hair out??

I too would have a fine and not a warning…but (maybe I shouldn’t post this for all CO’s to see) it seems to me that if you have a bullhead over 7 inches, you could have recieved a ticket for transporting live fish.

Although I understand why they don’t want you to transport live fish in your live well (MN has gone so far as to listing this ” it’s unlawful to transport live fish in your live well”) I like to keep my fish alive until they are cleaned.

That was indeed what I got the warning for…transporting live fish..

Dirk,

This might be something your local congressman or woman would love to take up with the DNR. I feel you have been treated poorly. Tax paying anglers should not be hassled in such a manner. The warden’s are doing the best they can with a confusing situation that as I see it is not addressed at all in Minnesota regs. I would think a warden pressed with the question: “show me in the regs where it says I can’t” would be enough to get you perpetual warnings.

I’ve thought about that…Just how does one go about getting the DNR to consider changing the law? How much clout can a few flathead fisherman have??…We’ll have to think about that one. Just one thing though, any calls or mail to the DNR should be done in a VERY RESPECTFUL manner. A few calls from some grumpy catfisherman could get us nowhere in a hurry.

OMG!!!

I agree with Gianni!!!! I don’t want go to prision!!!

I buy my suckers and fatheads in Hudson all the time!!!!

97C.341 Certain fish prohibited for bait.

A person may not use live minnows imported from outside of
the state, game fish, goldfish, or carp for bait.

I have to quit reading these laws! Or say goodbye to my family…hope they will visit me!?

Brian, did you say something like ” I was about to get frustrated in a hurry”……..

FYI – using bait from an out of state source…

Dirk…you maybe frustrated…I’m going to jail!

97A.301 General penalty provisions.

Subdivision 1. Misdemeanor. Unless a different
penalty is prescribed, a person is guilty of a misdemeanor if
that person:

(1) takes, buys, sells, transports or possesses a wild
animal in violation of the game and fish laws;

(2) aids or assists in committing the violation;

(3) knowingly shares in the proceeds of the violation;

(4) fails to perform a duty or comply with a requirement of
the game and fish laws;

(5) knowingly makes a false statement related to an
affidavit regarding a violation of the game and fish laws; or

(6) violates or attempts to violate a rule under the game
and fish laws.

Subd. 2. Gross misdemeanor. Unless a different
penalty is prescribed, a person convicted of violating a
provision of the game and fish laws that is defined as a gross
misdemeanor is subject to a fine of not less than $100 nor more
than $3,000 and imprisonment in the county jail for not less
than 90 days or more than one year.