Setting the hook

Advice needed here.

I have been chasing cats now for about two years with mild success and would like to see my hooksets improve.

My problem isn’t with the smaller cats, ( 1-15 lb range ), but rather with the times I have fished for the really big ones.

I have had no problems when using smaller sucker minnows, like those in the three to five inch range, but whenever I have tried to fish with decoy minnows, I have yet to hook any of the beasts that have made my minnow look like it went through a blender.

The setup I have used was a three-way swivel with two hooks being used to hold the bait, one through the tail and one through the lip.

I use a Calcutta 400 spooled with 25lb test line and a 1oz egg sinker to keep it down.

My thoughts on the hookset have been to leave the clicker on and allow the cat to run about 20 yards before setting the hook as I am thinking it will take awhile to eat a 12-14 inch bait.

However, my only results so far have been to have a freight train smoke my reel leaving me wetting my pants, only to pull in a severly mangled decoy minnow.

The other result was a time or two when I thought I had the fish hooked, but to lose it when the freeline was reeled back to the snagged egg sinker and to lose the entire setup due to the large sinker being caught up in the rocks.

Part of the problem is in that I am fishing from shore and the sideways current seems to wash the sinker nicely under the biggest rock it can find.

Do any of you use decoys for cats on the MN river? And if so, can you reccomend a better way to rig these fish or a tip or two on the timing of setting the hook?

TIA for any help.

Hey tpntp – From the situation you describe I am assuming you are fishing in some pretty significant current and from the shore casting out a ways. If you are fishing in a lot of current, which it sounds like since you are washing your egg sinkers into the rocks, I would go with a slip rig. I would recommend going with a no-roll sinker in at least a 3 oz size. I would also recommend shortening up your leader to about 6 inches or less. That is a really big sucker to fish in heavy current from shore. What size hook are you using? With a sucker that size I would be using about a 10/0 hook. In that kind of current you may want to lip hook your suckers so that they can streamline in the current and this should lessen the drag on your rig.

Another thing which would help in that kind of current, is dropping back on your bait size. In that heavy of current, they are feeding on anything floating by, and I’m not sure bait size is that critical. I would also recommend juicing up your bait a little bit by slicing them up with a knife along their lateral line. This releases some of the oil and bait’s bodily fluids into the water and will help fish in the current find your bait. By doing this you have a combination live bait/cut bait rig going. If you do this, change baits about every 15 minutes to keep fresh bait going.

If you want to stay with a 3-way rig on a 3-way swivel, you may want to use the sinker dropper line in a smaller diameter line than your main line. Use an 8# or 6# dropper line on your sinker. That way if it gets hung up, all you will break off is your sinker and you can get back in business right away with just adding a new sinker. Better bring along plenty of sinkers though in that kind of current. One other thing about sinkers in current, if you can, don’t fish straight out from your position on the shore. If you can cast quartering downstream at about a 45 degree angle it will reduce the drag on your main line and on your bait rig. It will allow your rig to hold better and you won’t get as much roll from your sinkers.

One other thing to consider when fishing from shore and in heavy current. The new superlines (Fireline, Superbraid, Powerpro, etc) have a very small diameter for their line strength. You can get a heavier strength line in a small diameter that will cut the water cleaner and works better in current. Another thing is that it has the power to pull loose from some snags better than a small diameter line. You can sometimes horse your way out of snags. By the same token, you can sometimes really tie yourself up too. It’s an idea to consider.

These are some ideas off the top of my head, kind of guessing at your situation. Good Luck. Let us know if these ideas helped.

Great suggestions, Thank You .

Is a “no roll ” sinker one of thse pyramid shaped ones?

Well, you’ve asked some good questions. I’m not sure I’ve got all the answers but I can start you out with a couple suggestions. First, it sounds like your using a variation of a quick strike rig with the two hooks. This two hook deal is illegal in Minnesota so what you should do if your going to continue to use this setup is add a small spinner blade to your line which would make your rig a “lure” and legal. (Another great Minnesota law). If your not fishing in MN, check your regs.

Another thing is ditch the 1 oz. egg sinker. Egg sinkers were conceived by the catfish devil to make our lives miserable. They role and role until they snag. They are ok if you fish them directly behind your boat. I’d go to a no-roll sinker or a at least a bank sinker. With a bait size of 12-14 inches I would not hesitate to use 6-12 oz. of weight to hold it in place. You may want to switch to just a basic slip rig.

Althlough I never really use baits as big as the ones your using because they are difficult to cast I don’t think I’d let them run 20 yards. I’m assuming your chasing flatheads with that size bait. Their mouths are huge and you don’t need to wait too long, even with a 12 inch bait.

Some other things to consider. Maybe switch to a single 10/0 hook through the tail. Maybe the fish that hit your baits are large channels or smaller (under 10 lbs) flatheads that can’t quite get the bait in their mouths. I’ve had 20 inch flatheads work 5 minutes to get a 7 inch bullhead down. Are you fishing known flathead water?

You may also try a braid for its no stretch properties if your having difficulty setting the hook. Your hooks pop free from the bait a bit easier with braids. 80lb Power Pro isn’t too big.

Heres some pics of the sinker I’d use.

The one marked “3” is a no-roll. The other is a bank sinker.

Try this link: http://catalog.catfishconnection.com/ Go to the no-roll sinker and click on the 3 oz no-roll and you will see a picture of one. They are a flat sinker with a hole down their center that you can run your line through. Your rig should consist of your main line running through the sinker, then a small bead threaded on your line (to protect your knot), tied to a barrel swivel with your short leader (6″ or less) tied to the other end of the barrel swivel. The barrel swivel will protect from line twist from your bait tumbling in the current.

I thought of a couple of other things you may want to consider. You mentioned letting the cat run for 20 yards with your bait – I wouldn’t let them run. I would set the hook immediately on the pick up. I would pick up the rod, reel down to the fish, holding the rod at about 10 o’clock I would try to turn the bugger inside out with a driving set.

One other thing to consider that I hope won’t confuse you. You may want to experiment with using circle hooks. They are the main type of hook I use for fishing channel cats. They are very effective if you can keep yourself from doing a normal hook set. If you are fishing from shore and your rod is normally in a rod holder this might be just the ticket for you. Leave your reel engaged so the line is tight to your bait. When the fish picks up the bait and runs with it, let him go and just lift your rod out of the holder and start reeling. If you pick up your rod and set the hook you will miss the fish. With circle hooks you have to let the fish hook themselves and you should just start reeling. They work great if you can control old hook setting habits plus you seldom get any gut hooked cats.

Hope this helps. Boy, do I want to go fishing bad.

Hey Comencharo, lets stop posting at the same time so we don’t repeat the same info over and over eh??

Sorry, Dirk. I didn’t see you were on-line till I finished.

Kind of a boring afternoon and I started responding and then got up and did a “honey do list” thing and came back and finished my response without refreshing the screen. One of those hit the send and then go “oops”.

I liked your idea on the 8 ounce bank sinker but your tackle box must weigh 500 lbs if you are lugging those things around. If you are fishing from shore that 8 oz sinker would let you throw clean to the other side of the river.

Great minds think alike.

tpntp, being new to the cat bug, my biggest confusing (and I have many) is the differant styles of hooks. Although these guys pointed me in the right direction, when I ordered my (first) bag of no-roll I ordered a free catalog from Catfish Connection. They have full size pictures of all types and sizes of hook.

Briank (catfisherman wannabe)

Dirk, what was that website with the Mustad hooks?

Hmmm, I’m not sure. This is the one with the 10/0 Gami’s I like. I wish the Catfish Connection sold them.

http://www.procatfish.com/

Guys,

Thank you for the very informative suggestions.

I did neglect to say that I use a spinner with this setup as I am fishing the Miinesota River near the Watergate Marina and am aware of that loophole concerning two hooks.

Here is a bad picture of the set-up as I described it.

I am using straight hooks purchased at Thorn Bros. but have wondered if the sharpness of the hooks was at fault to some degree.

I guess I will try to modify this rig with the tips you guys have given and hopefully this will allow me to see what sort of beast is destroying the decoy.

That was it Dirk…Thanks…old age.

Setting up a 3way like that is pointless. If you do it like the picture, your baitfish will end up sidways to the current. It will create a lot of resistance and probably drown them to boot. It could help bury the hook points in the bait also. The normal setup is one of the eyes of the swivel to the main line, bait, and sinker. The sinker is on it’s own terminal line so you can snag it and break it off an not lose the rest of the rig. i use regular swivels because 3ways are weak by design. good luck.

In light of all the responces and looking at the picture, I can see the flaws as well.

I rigged it this way initially because of the first missed hooksets and I wanted to get a hook into each end of the decoy. I have only done this twice without any success and that was the reason for the post.

Without anyone else there to critique it, it looked pretty menacing the times I used this set-up.lol

Oh well, live and learn.

I will definatly not be tying like that this year, but will instead use alot of the tips found here and prolly go buy a cat video or two as well.

Another reason was the extreme size of the bait. I think I will just scale down to a , oh, 7 inch bullhead this year with the 10/0 gami’s mentioned earlier.

Hey tpntp, I’m really glad that you asked the question. One reason is because I didn’t know “quick strike” rigs were outlawed! I’ve got one hanging in the garage from somewhere in the 80’s.

I was going to use decoy’s a couple times this year myself. The qs was in the plan, however i wouldn’t be in much current…I think it would work there although the qs rig I have has 4 hooks. The hook at each end looks like a horizontal “J” with another hook facing the other way..something like this “JL”. OK..so I can’t draw either!

I’ve always wondered why the rig of choice wouldn’t include two hooks. I guess all it takes is one

When you have some time, start moving backwards through the pages in this forum. After you filter out my B.S., this forum is really just a large book of info.

Check out the Pics that Dirk put up last year…They don’t call him “down and dirty” because he’s a gardener!
There’s many other that have posted too that cover hooks, rigging and much more. I review back pages…just to look at the pictures!

Good Luck! Don’t forget to post some pictures and let everyone know how your doing!

I use circles 90% of the time, and rarely use 3-ways..but when using j hooks on flatheads or big fish, its a good idea to apply pressure to the line during the hook set with your thumb on the spool to prevent drag slippage…I would also go with 3-6 ounce no-rolls and a slip sinker rig, with a 12/0 circle or the Big River Hooks made be gamakatsu