If I had a dollar for everytime I put someone on the spot, told them the exact details and tactics necessary, and they left empty handed… I’d have enough money for panoptix.
And thats just days they were biting!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The Truth!
-J.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Jon Jordan wrote:</div>
Instead of cutting limits and seasons, how about increase stocking? Every lake in the state could be another Red in short order.-J.
I believe the issue with stocking is that once you introduce a stocked fish, the genetic strain is diluted. That is why they prefer not to stock Mille Lacs with walleyes. They would rather have it remain “pure.” I think stocking is very beneficial for many species in certain bodies of water, don’t get me wrong.
The goal should be a naturally reproducing population with selective harvest IMO. Fish stocks are being depleted in many locations around the globe and without limitations there won’t be any left to catch, much less harvest.
First, Mille Lacs does not need to be stocked with walleye. If it did, they could do the stocking with fish caught in Mille Lacs.
As far a genetic goes, too late. The MN DNR is already stocking lakes with fish species that never existed in those lakes. Simply because a group lobbied for it. And I’m not taking about muskies.
-J.
If I had a dollar for everytime I put someone on the spot, told them the exact details and tactics necessary, and they left empty handed… I’d have enough money for panoptix.
And thats just days they were biting!
Sounds like you’re struggling as a “guide” to me…….
You are going on your experience with ONE body of water……
Just because you’re alone on the river doesn’t mean fishing pressure isn’t higher than ever….. also you’re taking about open water fishing, this is the ice fishing forum, it’s confusing isn’t it? Out of respect to the op let’s keep the discussion about pan-optics related to ice fishing.
Instead of cutting limits and seasons, how about increase stocking? Every lake in the state could be another Red in short order.
-J.
I’ll assume you’re joking with that comment. Obviously very very few, if any lakes in the state have the carrying capacity that Red does.
Are you paying for that stocking? There’s other fish than just walleyes being targeted in mn. I think the dnr already wastes a lot of money stocking walleyes in lakes they don’t belong in to begin with.
I’ll assume you’re joking with that comment.
Nope, no joke. 
I’ve fished 3 acre mud holes that were DNR rearing ponds at one time with just as good or better fishing than Red. It can be done.
-J.
First, Mille Lacs does not need to be stocked with walleye. If it did, they could do the stocking with fish caught in Mille Lacs.
As far a genetic goes, too late. The MN DNR is already stocking lakes with fish species that never existed in those lakes. Simply because a group lobbied for it. And I’m not taking about muskies.
I agree, I don’t think it needs to be stocked. I just remember a few years ago when people were clamoring for it to be re-stocked and the DNR’s reason was in relation to the genetics being altered.
I think Grubson is right, there are a lot of small lakes that are stocked with certain species of fish that really don’t need to be.
A $1500 add on to a $900 fish finder?
Not sure if they are still doing it, but Mille Las was being stocked with fish reared from Mille Lacs back in 2016. The tagging study is still in progress.
-J.
Cameras definitely help catch fish when the fish are negative. I took my 10-year old son ice fishing. I let him use the camera in down view and told him to set the hook when the white thing (euro larva) disappeared. He caught just as many sunfish and crappie as I did using a flasher and we both caught a lot of fish. Good thing I don’t keep fish very often.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>grubson wrote:</div>
I’ll assume you’re joking with that comment.Nope, no joke.
I’ve fished 3 acre mud holes that were DNR rearing ponds at one time with just as good or better fishing than Red. It can be done.
-J.
Geez now we are comparing Red lake to DNR rearing ponds (Which I also have a lot of experience with)
The DNR specifically finds ponds that freeze out and can’t sustain natural fish populations so the fish left behind don’t survive to consume the next years fry stocking.
Obviously sometimes it doesn’t work out that way and the fish survive and grow into catchable adults. The ponds that I know of that this has happened on are surely fun to fish but after a couple unsuccessful fishing stockings caused by predation they stop stocking them.
I have one near my house that we fished for a few years. The DNR has since stopped using that pond because the leftover fish weren’t dying and were canabilizing the new fry. It’s been about 5 years, the walleyes are still there, all 5-7 year old walleyes that have stunted and grew to a whopping 12″. All because the lake doesn’t support that many hungry mouths to feed.
Some lakes support healthy fish populations, some don’t. Just because it’s wet doesn’t make all water the same.
Agree. Let’s be honest most ice anglers are lazy. I mean they bring a house on wheels out with them so they can be “comfortable”
And 30 years from now your definition of “lazy” will become “old man” in the sense of ice fishing.
For us elders, it’s not about being lazy…but the body can’t do what a younger man’s body can do. And being comfortable typically can be the deal breaker on whether you even get out or not.
Sure, I’m still able to drag a portable out and drill a few of my own holes. But the older I get the more I appreciate driving out to a sleeper house with holes already drilled and the heat on. I’m fine sacrificing catching fewer fish while cracking beers, wearing pajamas and slippers.
And this goes for the Panoptix, I can make due without one for now.
Sounds like you’re struggling as a “guide” to me…….
Lol. They all do buddy.
grubson , you are clearly missing the point.
If the DNR chose to, they could make fishing good in your beer can. Cutting limits and slashing seasons because someone buys a “Fish Finder” is ridiculous.
If lakes actually do get decimated by this technology, the only solution will be stocking.
-J.
ice fishing forum, it’s confusing
I used si on ice 10yrs ago.
I used si on ice 10yrs ago.
My buddy’s uncle used the Fishin Buddy on ice back in the 90’s. He sat in his house and told us kids to “move 40 feet over there” and pointed. LOL
grubson , you are clearly missing the point.
If the DNR chose to, they could make fishing good in your beer can. Cutting limits and slashing seasons because someone buys a “Fish Finder” is ridiculous.
If lakes actually do get decimated by this technology, the only solution will be stocking.
-J.
I don’t think I am missing anything actually. First I never said anything about slashing seasons.
I think limits should be lowered with or without this new tech. This tech is just going to make it a necessity that much sooner.
The dnr could make a puddle good fishing? Ok, I guess, but without any sustainability is it really “good fishing”???
That’ll settle it then folks, everybody keep whatever they want. It doesn’t matter because the dnr will bail us out when the fish are gone. Makes perfect sense to me……
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>grubson wrote:</div>
ice fishing forum, it’s confusingI used si on ice 10yrs ago.
Ok. Your point?
We know you love your SI, and for good reason, it’s a good tool.
But again this discussion is supposed to be about Pan-optics and it’s contributions to over harvest.
grubson , you are clearly missing the point.
If the DNR chose to, they could make fishing good in your beer can.
-J.
Oh the possibilities, not even have to get off the couch.
You think they might increase license fees though? 
2410c71003870662a3a88fbb52205c59.jpg
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Brian Klawitter wrote:</div>
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mnfisherman18 wrote:</div>
Of course Live-scope does not automatically put fish in the boat, but creates massive advantages over previous technology. I am absolutely in favor of cutting bag limits in half.I’m not picking on anyone but MNFish is making my point clearer.
What about the thousands that can’t afford a locator let alone a camera and Live-Scope. Do they need their limits cut because (relatively) few people can afford high end bucket fillers?
We pay the DNR to watch our fish populations. Even the latest lowering of limits on the Mississippi, it was made clear the science didn’t call for it, the limits where changed for the public.
Just my 2 cents worth.
I understand completely. It’s a slippery slope. Maybe we can get people to post pictures of the fish house cities on Red & LOTW this weekend.
MnFish i’m pretty certain is gone.
I am not exactly sure what your point is Brian? I agree not everyone can afford expensive electronics. I would think bag limits already disproportionally effect the most successful anglers (electronics or no electronics) because they are the ones putting the most hours in and actually catching limits – that is why the limits exist. So yes, I do think limits should be reduced for a variety of reasons including new technology.
@Dutchboy I am not sure why you think I am gone? I agree with your points on the other factors straining fish populations.
@dutchboy I am not sure why you think I am gone? I agree with your points on the other factors straining fish populations.
Pretty sure he is referring to this post about MN Fish, not you.
http://www.in-depthoutdoors.com/community/forums/topic/mn-fish/
Much better than these new fangled electronics is a good pair of binoculars. I spend hours looking out the window of my comfy fishhouse watching to see who’s catching and where. Then when they leave at night I move my fishhouse onto that spot. It’s not that easy lining up their holes with the holes in my fishhouse floor…just sayin.
Technology of all sorts can wrongly be blamed for increased pressure and success on fisheries. Let’s not stop with just blaming Livescope, Panoptics, Huminbird 360, Mega Side imaging, etc.
New wheelhouses are technology. The latest all aluminum insulated 700# skid shacks are technology (they’re really booming the last 2 years). Social Media pages sharing posts with thousands of followers are technology. You hitting the remote start on your truck with heated seats for your drive to Northern MN is technology. The fully enclosed side x sides that drive like a car and are warm are technology. Navionics apps are technology. The high-end insulated portables being produced for cheaper than ever are technology. The all weather float suits, electric augers, custom rods, glow and tungsten jigs, etc. are all technology.
It isn’t one piece of technology’s fault. I don’t blame firearms when there is a mass shooting. I don’t blame vehicles when there is an accident, and I won’t blame the latest greatest technology if resources are put in jeopardy. Human anglers are the one common denominator behind all forms of technology and harvest. A mindset about “limits” and harvest will change in the near future whether people like it or not.
Do people really think URL is going back to its 4 fish bag limit after the pressure seen the last 3 weeks? Do people think Mille Lacs will have a harvest of more than 1 fish anytime in the next decade? Will bag limits on LOTW bump back up in the coming years? I’m hedging my bets on the exact opposite, and it doesn’t really bother me one bit.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>mnfisherman18 wrote:</div>
@dutchboy I am not sure why you think I am gone? I agree with your points on the other factors straining fish populations.Pretty sure he is referring to this post about MN Fish, not you.
http://www.in-depthoutdoors.com/community/forums/topic/mn-fish/
Thanks Jon – I wasn’t familiar with the MN Fish organization… @Dutchboy feel free to ignore my comments.
lol, heck I even ignore my own comments sometimes. 
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Ripjiggen wrote:</div>
Agree. Let’s be honest most ice anglers are lazy. I mean they bring a house on wheels out with them so they can be “comfortable”And 30 years from now your definition of “lazy” will become “old man” in the sense of ice fishing.
For us elders, it’s not about being lazy…but the body can’t do what a younger man’s body can do. And being comfortable typically can be the deal breaker on whether you even get out or not.
Sure, I’m still able to drag a portable out and drill a few of my own holes. But the older I get the more I appreciate driving out to a sleeper house with holes already drilled and the heat on. I’m fine sacrificing catching fewer fish while cracking beers, wearing pajamas and slippers.
And this goes for the Panoptix, I can make due without one for now.
Ok I take back the word lazy and change it to content. Didn’t think I was going to offend you and castle rock but you guys took my post more literal than it sounded in my head at the time.
That was my point Andy I think a large portion of ice anglers are similar to yourself and castle and are content hanging in the house catching some fish drinking a few pops maybe playing a game of cards during slow times. I don’t think panoptix is going to change that more than any other tech that has come out to catch more fish.
Red is a perfect example. Most ice fisherman hang out in the same spot in a house for the weekend. Not moving waiting for the fish to come to them. Would you ever do that in open water. Sit in the same spot for a weekend. Panoptix/Livescope isn’t going to change that or honestly help them drastically catch more fish. The guys that will use the tech are the same guys that are constantly trying to track down that bite and stay on that bite and probably would have been successful either way.
So let’s be honest most ice anglers are content. They bring a house with wheels out there so the can be “comfortable”.
Fish are cold blooded.
Metabolism much lower in cold water than warm water. I’d have to look up Brad Durick’s research, but I believe it’s more than 1000% less metabolism.
So. They eat less. Much much less in cold water periods. Think pea a day versus steak. Some eat a steak and wait a week.
Why do I bring up SI?
Well, during open water, using SI you can effectively and strategically map the fish in a fairly large area, especially with much experience….
I know the eyes are there, there, and there. Over there is quillback, and between the two are redhorse suckers… bam 30 waypoints. I’d venture few experience this but the technology has been there longer than 10yrs…
I know…
ice fishing right….
Recall above about metabolism. During warmer water periods there is no dog days of summer. Fish are eating a lot. Much more willing to be caught than cold water periods. I believe every fish eats every day during peak metabolic rates. I really believe that a hot bite in cold water metabolic rates 90% do not bite abs a typical day is 95%. As I said in a previous post, learning about when to go home.
Now that 5 minute scan in open water… using any ice fishing technology to scan and understand to the same degree what I described above would take, pfff…I dunno, a long time! Wouldn’t it be neat if it was possible to compare. Have a contest so to speak and compare waypoints on fish, fish species, e.t.c.
Ice fishing is so inefficient in finding fish versus open water. There’s just no comparison….i know, but there’s more fishing hours… yes, and a low metabolic rate is a great offset to the increase in fishermen. Accompanied with a significant lesser ability to find fish.
Ice fishing for me could never compete with capabilities I have on a boat in regard to finding, understanding, and catching fish. It keeps me off the ice year after year. To me panoptix on ice would, albeit be awesome in comparison to a flasher, camera, and si, it makes me feel like I’m reduced to a 5 gallon pail. It frustrated me, especially with a phenomenal river with year round access in the same state. Ice fishing efficiency pushed me away.
Knowledge, perseverance, technology all are equal parts necessary.
One should stop posting about ice fishing fish finding strategies… but we do, and it doesn’t usually turn into a lower limits, or mille lacs discussion. Those really help people get started!! Y’all are great for passing it along.
Just seems odd to single out a technology as the straw to break the camel’s back… when they’re is so many opportunities for that already. But, so many take fishing to a lesser degree than us. Which is why everyone with a license isn’t a great fisherman. They haven’t the desire to read all publications about fishing that would help them. Im not much for videos but they have their place I guess.
Sure some lakes topple. Right conditions stack up accompanied with some social gatherings from folks up to and beyond 100 miles away.
But do all lakes topple? Naw, just ain’t enough interest in the general public to fish that much, and frankly those perfect conditions don’t always happen, mother nature is an odd duck!
I’ll skip panoptix, though I have been drooling for a few years already. But maybe the next generation of tech. If there’s any fish left of course. Lol
Oh Boy!
Great thread.
To many individuals to respond to.
Some I 100% totally disagree with, some are spot on. IMHO of course.
Can’t stop technology! Period.
For me it’s another form of entertainment with the bonus of educating myself with fish.
This kinda reminds me of the Global warming argument.
Do you live in a home, drive a car, cook with a stove, etc.? If so, please don’t argue the global warming stuff.
Do you have a green box or any other electronics? Then please don’t rip the new tech.
It does make for a good discussion though.
Disclosure- This tech will not affect how many fish I keep. Guaranteed! I just like to fish.
Ok I take back the word lazy and change it to content. Didn’t think I was going to offend you and castle rock but you guys took my post more literal than it sounded in my head at the time.
Haha, no worries. I cannot speak for the clown, but myself? Another thing about getting older is your skin grows thicker. Never take any offense as personal. Because the problem is not me…it’s you. Ha
This thread started kinda “funny” right from the beginning, and as I’m sure you have witnessed it’s progression into a theatre of petty bickering (just my opinion) and you just happened to be on stage when I decided to throw peanuts from the gallery.
Just plain amusing, from all corners of the house I hear barking. 
I do believe it will have a impact on lakes if they don’t change the regs very soon.
The DNR will wait to make changes until its too late. The guys that buy all this equipment for themselves are the same guys that need the limit of walleyes to stay at 6 so they can “feed their family.”
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Bearcat89 wrote:</div>
I do believe it will have a impact on lakes if they don’t change the regs very soon.The DNR will wait to make changes until its too late. The guys that buy all this equipment for themselves are the same guys that need the limit of walleyes to stay at 6 so they can “feed their family.”
Yup!
Ok, off to go feed the family. Hoping to limit out on sunfish, crappies, nothern, walleye, large mouth, small mouth, rock bass (someone told me they are tasty).
Kinda got a hankerin for muskie cheeks under glass tonight.
Save me a cheek or two. How did you forget to mention burbot. You should be able to feed everyone at the bar! Or er um nevermind exiting stage left now.
Andy please use popcorn next time I have a peanut allergy. 
The DNR will wait to make changes until its too late. The guys that buy all this equipment for themselves are the same guys that need the limit of walleyes to stay at 6 so they can “feed their family.”
Yo…”bro”, always looking to blame the “establishment”?
You talking about my generation?
DNR tries to make changes before it’s too late but the “family feeding” protesters appear with pitchforks.
“Don’t you dare takeaway my guns or my right to feed my family” 
Yup!
Ok, off to go feed the family. Hoping to limit out on sunfish, crappies, nothern, walleye, large mouth, small mouth, rock bass (someone told me they are tasty).
Kinda got a hankerin for muskie cheeks under glass tonight.
Oh yeah, this thread reminds of the good old “wapatui” party.
Every arriving guest dumps a bottle of booze into the garbage can.
Drink it up… 
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I’ve fished 3 acre mud holes that were DNR rearing ponds at one time with just as good or better fishing than Red. It can be done. 
