CABIN BUILD IDEAS

buckybadger wrote:

For starters, I’d probably avoid a shouse or pole type building. In my opinion the cost savings is not what many think it is in present times.

No reputable contractor in the tundra will recommend trying to turn a true pole building into a living space. I talked to several about this because my perception was it would be the cheapest option, but they all said the same thing–don’t do it, you’ll regret it.

This “barndominium” crap is all the rage now, but look at where it’s being done. It’s all in much warmer and drier climates.

There is always movement in the poles of true pole-building construction in the frozen north. Unless you go through elaborate “house within a house” construction methods (which obviously destroy the cost advantage), then you’ll end up with constant issues with wall cracks and heaving/settling issues.

Nodakk wrote:

Just got done recently building our new home and GC’ing the project myself. We went with a floating slab single level with a 8/12 vaulted ceiling in the kitchen/living area. We always wanted a wall of windows with a view of the lake.

Take time planning and think about everything 3 times lol. Crazy how many times we changed our minds on something and how many things we would already of wanted to do differently.

One big factor to the design would be if you are planning on using year round. If your doing a floating slab, you’ll be installing infloor and running it all winter to keep frost away. I am in the plumbing/HVAC industry and you can PM me system questions. We went with an infloor system with central air, also an Aprilaire and ERV. Total comfort and humidity control. Also did a side arm tank from the boiler to heat our hot water. Much more efficient than a water heater.

Other things I would definitely surrounding our hobbies that we incorporated. Tall sidewalls in the garage, tallest garage doors you need (if you plan on another wheelhouse), 18’ wide double door, insulated and heated with infloor, garage walls and ceiling lined with pole barn tin, floor drain, ceiling fans in the garage, 30 amp RV outlet, hot water spigot with hose reel, and a utility sink in the garage.

Great points and additions. Man it’s easy to spend money that is someone else’s!

I agree completely as we went with an 18′ wide x 9′ tall double door, and a 10′ wide x 9′ tall third stall door. We only did a tin wainscoting in the garage and rocked the rest above it. We added x2 large fans and x2 floor drains along with the hot and cold water you mentioned. I’d not trade any of those things whatsoever.

IF you end up going with a basement, be sure to look into the pros and cons of floor trusses vs. I-beams associated with cost. We went with floor trusses and they were only $800 more and completely opened up the basement with no duct framing anywhere to lower ceilings.

Two other items I would consider must haves, especially a cabin in the north country.

1) Large mud room/laundry room. Gives yourself plenty of storage. If you want to get real particular like I did, plan out where you will have shelving and clothes hangers so you can plan for outlets to charge fishing electronics where they will be stored and places for boot dryers.

2) A 3 season screened in porch with a ceiling fan and outlets throughout. Invaluable with the mosquitoes.

Best advice so far –

By Nodak –
Take time planning and think about everything 3 times lol. Crazy how many times we changed our minds on something and how many things we would already of wanted to do differently.

When I have a project I set the plans on the Dining room table so I can look at it all the time, whether it be in passing or sitting down and studying. Take a of paper and draw a line down the center. Wants and Needs.

You will be amazed at how many things go back and forth.

I also take pics whenever I see something I may want/need, print it off and set it on the plan pile.

No matter what, when you project is complete you will say “next time I would do this, or do that differently.

What’s the budget for Well, septic, and heating? 3 season, or 3 1/2?
If a 3 season, you could get by with a heated floating slab. And what about a sauna? If you’re on a lake, you gotta consider a sauna.

There are so many options now that I don’t know how a person chooses. On top of that are the high costs today and delays in getting guys out to do the jobs you can’t do yourself. If you haven’t done so already, I would start by watching Youtube videos for hours on cabin tours. A lot of good ones are Airbnb tours. Gives you a good idea of different housing styles, layouts, siting, etc.

Another option is to get one of those pre-fabbed big shed/cabin things plopped down and by living in that on the land, you might get a better idea of what you actually want. Those things are pretty cheap. And it buys you a year or two more to hopefully wait out the price and labor shortages.

Nodakk wrote:

Large mud room/laundry room. Gives yourself plenty of storage. If you want to get real particular like I did, plan out where you will have shelving and clothes hangers so you can plan for outlets to charge fishing electronics where they will be stored and places for boot dryers.

Friends who farm in southwest MN built a new house and put in a great mudroom. In floor drain; washtub; washer & dryer (used only for farming clothes); hot and cold taps; shelving for boots/clothes; cabinets for laundry supplies and hanging rack for coveralls and the like. Genius.

Have two heat sources. One that doesn’t require electricity to operate.

I know you mentioned steel siding but have you thought about going lp smart side instead? Steel is high right now. Lp is good stuff and could save you some $ to put somewhere else.

Please keep the ideas coming! I read every word and will re-read them a hundred times and change my mind just as many.

Bearcat….you’re already hired and the first guy I was going ask

I talked with a couple friends today, one is my electrician I’ll be using to hook up and sign off, and another is a geo-thermal guy. Let’s just say they have contradicting ideas about geo-thermal

My electrician buddy said that ICF basement walls are a pain in the ass for a few reasons and said if he were pouring a basement today that he would do it with formed walls, then insulate and frame the interior (with either extruded or spray foam).

The cabin will most definitely be designed for 4 season use, but I want it to be efficient, yet still easy to use at a moments notice.

Here’s my thoughts….and I’m open to all input.

If we went with a full walkout basement, I’d build a utility room directly below the common wall shared with the plumbing in the bathroom and kitchen.

The utility room would be climate controlled 24/7/365. I’d install tees and ball valves on the supply lines to gravity drain the plumbing above to make winterizing a breeze and not heat the entire cabin for weeks/months when not using it.

All I would have to do is kill the supplies, drain them down, and dump a gallon or two of RV antifreeze into the toilet/sinks/shower traps.

I could heat the utility room a bunch of ways and have redundancy built in. For example, it could be in-floor heat with a separate zone on a propane boiler, have baseboard electric heat, and have a direct vent propane heater set to an “oh $hit there’s no power” setting lower than than other two thermostats.

I’d also have a cell phone hotspot or broadband to run a remote thermostat(s) and freeze alarms.

With those installed, I could remotely crank up the the primary heat source (likely forced air propane, but open to all ideas) to the entire cabin prior to getting there.

If insurance isn’t ridiculous for a wood burning fireplace/stove that would be a definite install (we have unlimited wood to burn).

As for the mudroom/entry, that’s a 100%. I plan on having a 10′ minimum wall when walking in, packed with coat hooks, shelves, outlets and could even incorporate a shower pan style floor with a drain for melting off augers and boots. If there’s “room” for a room even better, and could incorporate a fish cleaning station with the ability to spray down counters etc.

Back to the basement. If we go with a walkout, my dream is to have a set or two of French Doors (or a small insulated overhead, but it wouldn’t look as nice), and have the ability to drive in an ATV/UTV/Snowmobile to thaw out and have a linear drain installed in those areas.

These are all just ideas of mine. We’ll use the pizz out of the cabin for the first several year in the winter, but I know life will get busier every year and we’ll eventually go there less and less, especially in the winter. I’d prefer not to heat the entire place all of the time, but also want it to be easy to go to on a moments notice.

Power – Well – Septic (Omaha Area) We just spend $72k. Power was a 900′ run. We went with the 2nd lowest bid (most were $80-95k)

next time you’re up stop in and look at my fireplace, it’s a kozy heat air tight and it will drive you out, my wood box is built in on the side and is fed in through the garage by a drop door, no mess bringing wood through the house.

Browndog wrote:

Power – Well – Septic (Omaha Area) We just spend $72k. Power was a 900′ run. We went with the 2nd lowest bid (most were $80-95k)

That’s fricken crazy.

I just had a friend put in a well, mound septic, and power for 1/3rd of that in the same county as us in Wisconsin.

Beast wrote:

next time you’re up stop in and look at my fireplace, it’s a kozy heat air tight and it will drive you out, my wood box is built in on the side and is fed in through the garage by a drop door, no mess bringing wood through the house.

Heck yeah

B-man wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Browndog wrote:</div>
Power – Well – Septic (Omaha Area) We just spend $72k. Power was a 900′ run. We went with the 2nd lowest bid (most were $80-95k)

That’s fricken crazy.

I just had a friend put in a well, mound septic, and power for 1/3rd of that in the same county as us in Wisconsin.

Here in SW WI my power run to house 170 feet was $1100 (was quoted 900) 19 months ago.
Well 210 ft. deep $8500.
Non mound Septic $10400.
So $20k total.

If you are on propane I would personally go with the following HVAC setup. Infloor heat with a propane boiler, central furnace and A/C, and a wood burning fireplace or stove. You could keep the infloor set at 50ish degrees in the winter and quickly warm the place up with the wood burner when you arrive for a weekend. Use the wood burner all weekend for comfort temps or use the central system if the wife and kids complain. Central A/C for the best comfort in the summer.

Mini splits do work well if you buy the right brand. Biggest things with them is you need to be okay with seeing the big box on the wall (my wife wasn’t for our full time home). Also whatever room doesn’t have a unit directly in it is not going to feel comfortable, especially in summer. People might argue with me on this but think of putting a window A/C in one bedroom and not another. Close both doors at night and tell me which room is hotter.

Doesn’t sound like you are going to be spending a TON of time there in the winter. I don’t know if I would invest in a geothermal system. They are nice but that’s a big boy system for a part time place.

Also they are not the cheapest but an outdoor wood boiler would be incredibly nice if your on propane.

Also with infloor you can zone off areas with separate thermostats. Could be as simple as house and garage separate. Or could also zone off bathrooms and set for a higher temp to be cozy in the morning shower. Piping can also be ran along shower walls…

My cabin’s furnace is Dual fuel, also have a boiler for in floor heat in the lower level, master bath and foyer.
Monitored security system that also has a low temp indicator along with a wifi stat.
A few years ago I added a whole house Generator.

I sleep well at night.

When I built my cabin (walkout with block foundation) my dad (retired masonnry contractor) convinced me that with some sheet rock on the main floor, if I didn’t heat the cabin year round, the foundation would have more movement and result in the sheet rock getting more cracks. I’ve kept the cabin heated year round but turn it down to 50 degrees when we aren’t there. I have 1 or 2 spots that have minor cracks over the past 25 years. It cost me about 1500.00 per year to heat at todays prices. If you go with knotty pine instead of sheetrock maybe it isn’t a big deal.

Wood heat backup is certainly not a bad idea given you have the free fuel.
We have forced air LP and our backup is a free standing LP fireplace. (If you could call it a backup) When we are at the cabin every weekend in the winter we only use the fireplace to heat. The furnace is left on 50 to maintain while we are not there.

suzuki wrote:

Wood heat backup is certainly not a bad idea given you have the free fuel.
We have forced air LP and our backup is a free standing LP fireplace. (If you could call it a backup) When we are at the cabin every weekend in the winter we only use the fireplace to heat. The furnace is left on 50 to maintain while we are not there.

How many square feet are you heating? What’s a ball park on propane used through a winter?

B-man wrote:

The utility room would be climate controlled 24/7/365. I’d install tees and ball valves on the supply lines to gravity drain the plumbing above to make winterizing a breeze and not heat the entire cabin for weeks/months when not using it.

Think twice. Having an interior go to 0 or below is very hard on every component of the house, let alone as mentioned shifts and cracks. It sounds like a good idea to save a few bucks but the consequences could require a lot of maintenance and rework.
If you end up with forced air consider a multispeed furnace fan to circulate air 24/7 just slightly when you are not there. This is especially true if you end up with a basement.

bzzsaw wrote:

When I built my cabin (walkout with block foundation) my dad (retired masonnry contractor) convinced me that with some sheet rock on the main floor, if I didn’t heat the cabin year round, the foundation would have more movement and result in the sheet rock getting more cracks. I’ve kept the cabin heated year round but turn it down to 50 degrees when we aren’t there. I have 1 or 2 spots that have minor cracks over the past 25 years. It cost me about 1500.00 per year to heat at todays prices. If you go with knotty pine instead of sheetrock maybe it isn’t a big deal.

Your Dad is a wise man.

B-man wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Browndog wrote:</div>
Power – Well – Septic (Omaha Area) We just spend $72k. Power was a 900′ run. We went with the 2nd lowest bid (most were $80-95k)

That’s fricken crazy.

I just had a friend put in a well, mound septic, and power for 1/3rd of that in the same county as us in Wisconsin.

Those numbers above seem high, but it’s all relative to where you build. We are in SE MN about 2 miles from Pool 4 along the bluffs. I was just in the office tonight and pulled a few binders.

Our well is about 80’ down and cost us $8500

Our septic is a non mound gravity system (no pump) running to a tank and field sized for the house (6 beds, 3.5 baths) and it all cost us $8900

Like I said before, the power quote from Xcel for 1200’ was around $31k so we ditched that plan and have the panel off the main road 150’ and went from there to the house with our electrician for less than half.

ICF foundation ran us $56k which included step footings, sidewalls, basement floor, 12 x 20’ elevated front porch and 960’ of garage floor. Poured walls would have been similar but a bit cheaper if I recall on the bids.

For reference we bought our house package when lumber dipped August of 2021 locking in prices, and the project finished in June of 2022. I ran into our contractor last week on a different job and he estimated our place would be $40-60k more to build today one year later. I think inflation will slow and some point stop, but don’t ever expect labor rates and most materials to drop…rather establish new floors where they’re at.

What bucky said about cost. Lumber is down BUT everything else is up. Windows, doors, insulation, cabinets, countertops, flooring, etc, etc.

MX1825 wrote:

What bucky said about cost. Lumber is down BUT everything else is up. Windows, doors, insulation, cabinets, countertops, flooring, etc, etc.

Electrical wiring is the worst !!!

Keypad lock for the door.
Nothing like driving up to the cabin without the door key.

B-man wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>suzuki wrote:</div>
Wood heat backup is certainly not a bad idea given you have the free fuel.
We have forced air LP and our backup is a free standing LP fireplace. (If you could call it a backup) When we are at the cabin every weekend in the winter we only use the fireplace to heat. The furnace is left on 50 to maintain while we are not there.

How many square feet are you heating? What’s a ball park on propane used through a winter?

First full winter here, but we’re heating the entire 3800sq ft to 69 degrees and run a seperate furnace on the garage along with a fireplace. I set a full 1000 gallon tank with the lull in November. I need to get out and see where I am at this weekend.

I’d think that if you are staying in the size range you mentioned building a good tight house, don’t go crazy with the amount of glass, and are turning everything way down to 50 degrees or so ~500 gallons a year could be a ballpark guess? Complete crapshoot with MN weather though.

I know a good septic guy when it comes time too.

If it hasn’t been said yet, I’d suggest a metal roof with enough pitch to shed snow.