Buying American Made

Looking to understand the argument that people make that its better to purchase an “American made” truck like a Ford/Dodge/Chevy over a tundra. I often hear “Toyota makes a great truck but you’ll never see me in one”. Now im not an expert so please feel free to correct me if im wrong. Thats why im writing this is to better understand. According to multiple sources Toyota is the most American made vehicle there is (https://www.toyotawarsaw.com/blog/tundra-vs-ram-silverado-titan-sierra/). I understand they are assembled in TX whereas i think other American manufactures mainly assemble in Mexico. If this is the case wouldnt that put more money into the pockets of Americans? Wouldnt that be generating more jobs for people in this country? Is the idea behind buying “American made” that a company like Ford will keep their money in American rather than take it back to Japan? Does this strictly boil down to symbolism and a sentiment of what we grew up with? Honestly trying to understand from the side of those that say they would never buy a Toyota Truck. I hear the answer is because American made but i dont hear much beyond that or what that means to them.

crappie55369 wrote:

Looking to understand the argument that people make that its better to purchase an “American made” truck like a Ford/Dodge/Chevy over a tundra…Does this strictly boil down to symbolism and a sentiment of what we grew up with?

You’re pretty much on the money here. Essentially any company will find the most cost effective way to manufacture their products. Any company large enough (all the major automotive giants you’d recognize) with the global presence and purchasing power to do so will drive their suppliers to near-zero or even negative margins (pending supply contract margin thresholds and renewal frequency). Long story short, if you go down the supply chain far enough, all of these companies source products from the cheapest possible sources, usually outside of America. My background is primarily in plastics and metal fab, for example. Even if Chevy is assembling in an American plant, their suppliers and their suppliers’ suppliers and on down the line are sourcing their raw materials globally. They may purchase their nylon via an American distribution company, but the nylon itself is either made overseas or its raw monomers are made overseas. Often they’ll tout their suppliers as being American if someone asks, but those suppliers (generally speaking) have an American presence but do most of their work elsewhere. People just don’t dig that far. Ain’t no company manufacturing for higher cost purely out of the goodness of their hearts. And don’t get me started on subsidizing domestic manufacturing because that just shifts the conversation for the sake of looking good up front and benefiting a relatively small labor pool, but comes at the expense of consumers overall. Sorry for the rant but I majored in economics with a specialization in econometrics and international finance. I’ve also worked in manufacturing, including the automotive industry, ever since.

My buddy just bought a brand new Tundra. If I ever decide to buy a pickup it’s going to be a Tundra. They are SWEET.

I also agree that you’re spot on…but you also need to consider that it wasn’t long ago that Japan wasn’t very well liked. If in 40-50 yrs Iraq or Afghanistan made a good quality truck, would you buy it??? I think some of these people who won’t sit in a Toyota base it off that then the fact about it being made in the US.

By the way, my Tundra has been great. 105,000+ miles so far. Hoping for another 150K!

What’s a bad quality product originated or currently coming from Japan? Any industry. Their quality control practices have been sought after for decades.

When they redesign the Tundra I’ll seriously look at them.

I agree with you crappie….my only issue with the tundra is the old design and the terrible mileage.

I see as many quality issues coming from any country. You have to take American made with a grain of salt, are they taking into account the design, sourcing, engineering that goes on, or just where assembled and where parts come from? I prefer to support companies that have the job that I perform in this country. For example if I was a CEO I would purchase from a company that has a CEO based in the US, not Japan, China, Germany, etc.

onestout wrote:

I prefer to support companies that have the job that I perform in this country.

That’s part of the argument for the tundra in that it creates more jobs in America. Maybe I’m not understanding you correctly

I have owned 2 Ford F-150 both assembled in USA. Like many have said most if not all parts are made in other countries, most from Mexico. My wife’s Edge was built in Mexico, not so proud of that fact. I am of the “old school” train of thought buy American if I can, even though any one can own a company from almost any country through buying stocks. But I like the idea that the money stays in the USA if I buy from a “usa” company. One other thing people forget is that a lot of these foreign auto makers have not been in the USA long and do not have the cost of retired UAW members so the cost of the vehicle should be a lot cheaper. Ford spends more money on labor cost than is does on steel/ aluminum to build a vehicle.

I’ve got four years on my 2013 tundra, not so much as a hiccup, things a Swiss army watch. My wife’s ford explorer is sucking us dry. Six wheel bearings, both u joints , heater actuator motor twice, exhaust broke twice so far.front end leaks , rear end leaks, things rusting out faster then I can believe. Window control switch twice. Rear hatch latch broke. We bought it two years old with 30,000 on it.

Also it wasn’t long ago 2013 Toyota has a frame recall because they were rusting so bad they would buckle. There was word that the metal was subpar at best.

I’ve not heard of a frame recall, my frame looks new still and I live in northern Minnesota . Not saying your full of it just that I’ve not heard of it.

https://www.autoblog.com/2016/11/14/toyota-3-billion-settlement-rusty-truck-frames/. Follow link this was on the main stream media not that long a go. A quick search Toyota frame rust and you will find more than enough pics and articles

Looks like my truck not included in recall. They must have fixed it by then on the tundra. Like I said mine still looks new.

Glad to hear your truck is not affected. Kinda hard to get this out of my head when I was looking for a new truck in 2015

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Craig Thompson wrote:

Also it wasn’t long ago 2013 Toyota has a frame recall because they were rusting so bad they would buckle. There was word that the metal was subpar at best.

Lots of those years Toyota’s have bad frames. Call the dealerships and they will tell you. Coworker just had a new frame paid for by Toyota put under his truck. Extreme frame rot with 92xxx miles on it

Bottom line is there isn’t one major manufacturer that can even come close to claiming made in USA. Not one.

Assembled in USA is what you see on most vehicles. Not sure it really matters beyond that. A few percentage points one way or the other isn’t going to make much of a difference.

What it boils down to is what investors want. Pretty much every decision about where parts are made is with the the investors and the customer best interest in mind. Biggest profit with at the best price. American jobs come after that.

As an engineer, I sure care about where my vehicle gets designed. I’m certain not every component is designed in the US on a Chevy, Ford or ram, but I’m guessing it’s more than a Toyota??? The manufacturing is just one element in the supply chain.

Ive owned only fords and general motors cars and trucks. Still own my first ford but prefer gm. My buddy has a new tundra and its a nice truck but no way you could get me to switch for my chev suburban. Take a 5 hour ride in both and the chev gets more votes. I buy american any chance i can and prefer to support my local businesses. Even knowing there’s no guarantee anything is “made in the usa” put the american flag over the made in china sticker and were good. I doubt anyone buys a foreign car in hopes to hurt the us economy. And my boat has a suzuki…

To the anti Toyota enthusiasts above. Toyota did take care of everyone with their bad frames. Buyback 1.5 times the book value of the earlier generations and new frames within 12 years of truck year of the 2nd generations. My 07 Tacoma sits on a brand new frame. Not a penny out of my pocket and gave me a new Tacoma to drive while the dealer replaced the frame.

Craig Thompson wrote:

Also it wasn’t long ago 2013 Toyota has a frame recall because they were rusting so bad they would buckle. There was word that the metal was subpar at best.

Recalls??? Pretty weak reach here buddy…just about every manufacture has had rust recalls and every manufacture has some type of other call.

https://www.hotcars.com/pickups-that-are-notorious-rust-buckets-that-never-rust/

mustangsally wrote:

Take a 5 hour ride in both and the chev gets more votes.

This makes me laugh. Two summers ago, I had a Tahoe and replaced the engine at 100K miles. I now have a Sequoia. Aside from the engine BS, the Tahoe was a nice truck, but I would pick the Sequoia 10 times outta 9!

This thread is a fight waiting to happen, and nothing will get solved by it. Get the popcorn, I am staying out of this one. I already want to throat punch someone

“Made in America”

Sounds great and has a very patriotic tone to it. But at the end of the day, the vast majority of Americans are going to buy the cheapest priced item.

I’ve worked with numerous manufactures that source/manufacture here in the States, and source things globally. By the time an item hits a retail shelf in a store, most US items are 2 to 5 times more.

sticker wrote:

This thread is a fight waiting to happen, and nothing will get solved by it.

Agreed. I think Crappie just wanted to stir the pot.

Look at the JD Power rankings. The fact is that these days EVERYBODY is making good vehicles and everybody still lays an egg once in a while.

The problem with individual opinions of vehicles is that our sample size is so limited. How many of us buy 20 of one model truck so we can get a sense for the overall quality over a 5 year / 70k miles (on each truck) period? Nobody.

Yes, I like the idea of “Made in America”, but I’ve also been disappointed in the reality of it because so many of the parts are made overseas that the actual work provided to Americans that are screwing together of all these parts seems like a drop in the bucket.

Grouse

sticker wrote:

I already want to throat punch someone

You can throat punch me! Let me get geared up and Ill come swing by your office with a view….one sec!

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When it comes to making the actual parts that everything is made with OEM’s don’t have much of a choice on where it is made. It is survival of the fittest and if a supplier doesn’t make the highest quality part at a reasonable cost they are out of business in short order. And everyone is getting their parts from the same place. An example is almost every vehicle out there has Bosch injectors, almost every vehicle has a Magna camera/brake detection system. OEM’s have very little say in where these parts are made and for the most part don’t care as long as they are to print and can meet the cost.

I bought American because I needed a 1 ton and with that wanted diesel. Can’t get that in the foreign market. American quality isn’t what it once was anyway. We have gone to the idea that things are disposable and just get a new item. Take snowmobiles for example I’ve owned Polaris, Artic Cat, and Yamaha. Pop the hood on the Polaris or Cat and there’re burrs , poor fitted parts….. That Yamaha is flawless. This is just one example. The list goes on and on.