Back to School ?

waldo9190 wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>B-man wrote:</div>
I’m pretty sure the average stay at home mom is capable of teaching and handling half a kindergarten class. Christ, I could do it (I’d have to leave my weapons at home though) lol

I’m also pretty sure the average second grade teacher is capable of teaching sixth grade, the average sixth grade teacher capable of teaching the eighth grade etc, etc.

75 year old Mrs. Smith can stay-at-home.

An issue with this idea is that many elementary school teachers (my wife included) only have a certification for grade levels K-6, so the amount of jockeying that they would be able to do is limited. Also, I would pump the breaks on the “anyone can teach” mantra. My wife teaches 4th grade, and based on the amount of phone calls she received from parents that were either complaining about the amount of work being sent home (MINIMAL compared to non-quarantine life) or panicking because they couldn’t figure out how to help their child I would say that most parents aren’t cut out to teach for any significant period of time.

That being said, my wife and many of her coworkers are ready to be back in the classroom. The efficiency of teaching remotely wasn’t even in the same ballpark as what they are able to accomplish in the classroom, and this was really disappointing for the teachers that care about their job (and the kids).

Waldo, that was my point.

We will have to make sacrifices and “bend the rules” if we want schools to have younger and healthier teachers.

Paras currently working in elementary schools could step up and teach the classroom, even if they’re not technically qualified. They’re used to the environment and developing children.

A sixth grade teacher could handle a grade or two higher, even if they’re not licensed for it.

There IS going to be a teacher shortage, and we WILL need a solution…. Having slightly under-qualified people in place is better nobody at all. Businesses do it all the time and it “usually” works out

buckybadger wrote:

However, it’s not nearly as simple as anyone makes it out to be. Putting plans into action that have never been attempted before isn’t easy.

Agreed. Lots of “Just do this, this, and that and it’ll be fine.” Everything always seems so easy when just talking about it on the surface.

buckybadger wrote:

What are the IDO thoughts on our season happening? RCTC just cancelled all fall sports a day or two ago.

This is where the bad sports news just keeps getting worse. I really like and watch a ton of football, baseball, and hockey, but football is my favorite. I really don’t see high school football happening. At this point I’ll be happy to see NFL if they can pull it off. My overall favorite sport is college football and I don’t know if I like their chances because it’s tied to being a student as well as an athlete, and I’m not sure schools across the board will physically be in attendance.

Somewhat related, but has anyone else noticed the number of families grocery stores where the parents are wearing masks but the children arent? I’ve seen it on multiple occasions recently, found it interesting. I have no kids so I’m not very knowledgable on the topic. CDC just stated that theres no proof that children are driving the transmission spread. Then again, theres a news article from today about 82 kids in missouri being positive for covid after spending time at a summer camp. Not a great look

There’s so many kids that only get structure from school and sports in particular, if neither happen this year it will be devastating to the future of thousands of kids.

Well Bucky, I am pretty sure you already have a bad gut feeling about your answer.

If people are going to freak out about a positive (which the media sure does) then you are most definitely NOT going to play fall sports. If you take the positive out and test properly, avoid grandparents, etc, then there is no reason you can’t move on with this “new normal”.

buckybadger wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>lindyrig79 wrote:</div>
What is pretty simple is that kids NEED school.

Regular hand washing every hour. Space desks further apart. Masks when appropriate. Increase cleaning and disinfectant use throughout the day and/ or night. Regular temp checks getting on bus and arrival at school.

And finally, for those teachers who feel the risk is too high take an unpaid leave and job waiting for you when you are ready to return.

Most of the desks in our district are wall to wall in rooms(25-30 kids). Remodeling isn’t in the budget.

What’s the best way to take temperatures of ~1000 kids in the 25 minute window that most arrive before the day starts (and keeping them socially distant while they wait)?

Where do the funds come from to hire janitorial staff at twice the number of hours currently contracted? A building with each wing being 10s of thousands of sq feet doesn’t disinfect itself during the day or at night.

I’m not picking apart your ideas to Target them as bad. I’m sure lots of districts may implement some of those ideas. However, it’s not nearly as simple as anyone makes it out to be. Putting plans into action that have never been attempted before isn’t easy.

I coach football. What are the IDO thoughts on our season happening? RCTC just cancelled all fall sports a day or two ago.

Again, every “essential” business continued operations while schools simply closed. Easy route imo.

All businesses who have remained or are now open for business pose similar risk to kids going to school. Should we close some things to open school? Risk for risk. Zero sum transaction? Why is a bait shop open, but not a school?

FishBlood&RiverMud wrote:

Again, every “essential” business continued operations while schools simply closed. Easy route imo.

All businesses who have remained or are now open for business pose similar risk to kids going to school. Should we close some things to open school? Risk for risk. Zero sum transaction? Why is a bait shop open, but not a school?

Same answer as any other year. It’s summer.

Ice Cap wrote:

Her social skills are entirely inadequate for a 18 year old.
very socially awkward.

Probably related to the First Family?

FishBlood&RiverMud wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>lindyrig79 wrote:</div>
What is pretty simple is that kids NEED school.

Regular hand washing every hour. Space desks further apart. Masks when appropriate. Increase cleaning and disinfectant use throughout the day and/ or night. Regular temp checks getting on bus and arrival at school.

And finally, for those teachers who feel the risk is too high take an unpaid leave and job waiting for you when you are ready to return.

Most of the desks in our district are wall to wall in rooms(25-30 kids). Remodeling isn’t in the budget.

What’s the best way to take temperatures of ~1000 kids in the 25 minute window that most arrive before the day starts (and keeping them socially distant while they wait)?

Where do the funds come from to hire janitorial staff at twice the number of hours currently contracted? A building with each wing being 10s of thousands of sq feet doesn’t disinfect itself during the day or at night.

I’m not picking apart your ideas to Target them as bad. I’m sure lots of districts may implement some of those ideas. However, it’s not nearly as simple as anyone makes it out to be. Putting plans into action that have never been attempted before isn’t easy.

Again, every “essential” business continued operations while schools simply closed. Easy route imo.

All businesses who have remained or are now open for business pose similar risk to kids going to school. Should we close some things to open school? Risk for risk. Zero sum transaction? Why is a bait shop open, but not a school?

I’d give the opinion that I’m somewhat surprised you’re not seeing or recognizing the point or facts buckybadger has put forth.

There’s more obstacle’s here than just the risks, real or imagined.

I’ve highlighted them in case that was overlooked.

A bait shop has what, a handful of employees and customers at any given moment?

I get what he’s saying…I was listening to talk radio this afternoon and they questioned even bus transportation. To practice safe social distancing, a bus capacity of 80 kids would need to limit them to 40. So now what? Another bus that wasn’t planned or budgeted for? Another bus driver too?

I understand the advocating to reopen schools but I see that some want to pound their fist on a table and demand “make it so”…

I don’t know, maybe some of these “essential” businesses that have continued operations would be willing to provide gratuitous consulting services to the school districts (on a limited budget) on how to reopen…just that plain and simple?

I’m of the opinion that if we can’t find a way (we can) to do any of the suggestions I outlined earlier that we send the kids back anyway.

It’s that important.

blank wrote:

Same answer as any other year. It’s summer.

Lol

Back up to February and the question applies. Obviously this discussion applies forwards past today into fall

Walleyestudent Andy Cox wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>FishBlood&RiverMud wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>buckybadger wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>lindyrig79 wrote:</div>
What is pretty simple is that kids NEED school.

Regular hand washing every hour. Space desks further apart. Masks when appropriate. Increase cleaning and disinfectant use throughout the day and/ or night. Regular temp checks getting on bus and arrival at school.

And finally, for those teachers who feel the risk is too high take an unpaid leave and job waiting for you when you are ready to return.

Most of the desks in our district are wall to wall in rooms(25-30 kids). Remodeling isn’t in the budget.

What’s the best way to take temperatures of ~1000 kids in the 25 minute window that most arrive before the day starts (and keeping them socially distant while they wait)?

Where do the funds come from to hire janitorial staff at twice the number of hours currently contracted? A building with each wing being 10s of thousands of sq feet doesn’t disinfect itself during the day or at night.

I’m not picking apart your ideas to Target them as bad. I’m sure lots of districts may implement some of those ideas. However, it’s not nearly as simple as anyone makes it out to be. Putting plans into action that have never been attempted before isn’t easy.

Again, every “essential” business continued operations while schools simply closed. Easy route imo.

All businesses who have remained or are now open for business pose similar risk to kids going to school. Should we close some things to open school? Risk for risk. Zero sum transaction? Why is a bait shop open, but not a school?

I’d give the opinion that I’m somewhat surprised you’re not seeing or recognizing the point or facts buckybadger has put forth.

There’s more obstacle’s here than just the risks, real or imagined.

I’ve highlighted them in case that was overlooked.

A bait shop has what, a handful of employees and customers at any given moment?

I get what he’s saying…I was listening to talk radio this afternoon and they questioned even bus transportation. To practice safe social distancing, a bus capacity of 80 kids would need to limit them to 40. So now what? Another bus that wasn’t planned or budgeted for? Another bus driver too?

I understand the advocating to reopen schools but I see that some want to pound their fist on a table and demand “make it so”…

I don’t know, maybe some of these “essential” businesses that have continued operations would be willing to provide gratuitous consulting services to the school districts (on a limited budget) on how to reopen…just that plain and simple?

Buy any meat lately? Very challenging to conform operations to current cdc recommendations, the packing plants. They’re doing better. Production is obviously down, but must go on. I think kids are as important as my steaks. Risk to society similar.

It wouldn’t take a heck of a lot of effort to reduce spreading in school just as all businesses have attempted to do and continue to an extent. Businesses aren’t restricting what people do outside of the workplace much different than before. But they have all taken a hit in productivity to reduce transmission within their means. I wouldn’t think the school would be any less. But it sure must me better for the kids than what they’re not getting sitting at home.

Many businesses are operating at a highly reduced budget this year! I don’t see why schools are any different. Fund what is important. Lots of cash distributed this year. Why am I not surprised there’s zero for education operations during a pandemic while many recieve amounts exceeding normal working pay.

FishBlood&RiverMud wrote:

Buy any meat lately? Very challenging to conform operations to current cdc recommendations, the packing plants. They’re doing better. Production is obviously down, but must go on. I think kids are as important as my steaks. Risk to society similar.

It wouldn’t take a heck of a lot of effort to reduce spreading in school just as all businesses have attempted to do and continue to an extent. Businesses aren’t restricting what people do outside of the workplace much different than before. But they have all taken a hit in productivity to reduce transmission within their means. I wouldn’t think the school would be any less. But it sure must me better for the kids than what they’re not getting sitting at home.

Many businesses are operating at a highly reduced budget this year! I don’t see why schools are any different. Fund what is important. Lots of cash distributed this year. Why am I not surprised there’s zero for education operations during a pandemic while many recieve amounts exceeding normal working pay.

Well dad-gum, that is the sometimes surprise here…a logical, factual, if not rebuttal but response engaging respectfully in a discussion.

You did reply/offer valid points here and I and hopefully other’s learned more than we thought we knew.

Thanks for your insight on this and I sincerely say that.

“I don’t know, maybe some of these “essential” businesses that have continued operations would be willing to provide gratuitous consulting services to the school districts (on a limited budget) on how to reopen…just that plain and simple?”

Andy, we are working with essential businesses everyday (trucking) and not one business is alike on a national level. Our drivers can walk into one place, unload freight, use the bathroom and share a pizza with the office personal. The next place he cannot enter, has to use a portable bathroom and they will not transfer paperwork but is told they will transfer online “illeagal by the way” and we have to go with the flow.

This whole deal is so confusing and divided on a national level. A consulting service is a waste of money beyond making people fell better about them being involved. I understand what you are saying but this is my realistic view of what we would see. Every school would be a little or a lot different and think that will be the outcome either way on this one. As it should be. They are all different. Less rules and cost is better in my opinion. That’s being pretty optimistic now days. Haha.

I guess I just worry about Minnesota. Specifically our school district and have not talked to a teacher yet that does not want to see the kids back this fall for many reasons stated above. If they have to do this hybrid option attending both in school and distance learning it will add a lot of work/time to teachers that already have a lot with 25 plus students in the room.

I did like the idea stated earlier about high risk teacher focusing on distance learning and in class being where they belong. However that is not one of the 3 options we were voting on here in south Washington. Our Hybrid option (#2 of 3 options) is similar but the in class teacher has to teach both in class and distance.

Sorry for the long post and hate to say it. I just feel bad and am worried about these kids. All of them. This is a lot more concerning to me than a virus that is driven by media/political Fear. It’s a damn shame.

buschman wrote:

Sorry for the long post and hate to say it. I just feel bad and am worried about these kids. All of them. This is a lot more concerning to me than a virus that is driven by media/political Fear. It’s a damn shame.

No…no apologies needed. I and hopefully other’s welcome non- confrontational comments and input. Some common sense thinking without the somewhat usual bickering that has become all too regular.

Civil discussion here should be the counter to the discourse and division that has become yet another symptom of the pandemic itself.

Thank you for adding and not subtracting from the conversation here.

If there is any essential business in the country it is our schools. Regardless of where you fall on the spectrum of believing the COVID hype, I think most agree we need kids back. I believe it needs to be a safe environment for kids and staff but the risk of no school and the long term impacts on this generation outweigh the health risks. We need to start thinking of it in terms of short term risk versus long term if our kids miss a year or more of school.

We have a daughter starting kindergarten this year. She is an absolute sponge and learns new things everyday. This is the year she will start learning to read, do math, etc. I am not a teacher…nor is my wife. Our jobs don’t give us the freedom to home school. We absolutely need her in school with qualified teachers and structured curriculum.

Tough decisions for sure…I don’t want to minimize that. But we need to get the kids back.

Will my contribution to fund said schools go down? I get taxed locally for our school and also get taxed for university and or tech schools in our state?

I’m ok paying it, but not if the school is not open on campus too teach..

Go back to school. Why?

There is a reason Sweden is not in the news…

Sweden has not closed much of anything and the death rate is really low now. High early yes. Not any more. If Sweden was really really bad, the fake news would be all over it. Not a word from the media. Hmmm. Interesting.

Yes it’s a different country. They still have cities with million peoples. I’m sick of the argument that Sweden is not the US.

Flame me if you want. Open everything up. We are just dragging this out. And Masks don’t work.

I have 4 Granddaughters two go to school.. they need a qualified teachers and structured curriculum this year.

DTW wrote:

Go back to school. Why?

There is a reason Sweden is not in the news…

Sweden has not closed much of anything and the death rate is really low now. High early yes. Not any more. If Sweden was really really bad, the fake news would be all over it. Not a word from the media. Hmmm. Interesting.

Yes it’s a different country. They still have cities with million peoples. I’m sick of the argument that Sweden is not the US.

Flame me if you want. Open everything up. We are just dragging this out. And Masks don’t work.

I literally just read an article in the Minneapolis paper today about Sweden. LOL
It definitely was not a good article.

The greatest quandary is how will the neo-socialists ensure they keep pumping out mini Marxists from their 12 year mandatory government indoctrination camps if they successfully impose their security theater upon everyone by forcing school closures?

DTW wrote:

Go back to school. Why?

There is a reason Sweden is not in the news…

Sweden has not closed much of anything and the death rate is really low now. High early yes. Not any more. If Sweden was really really bad, the fake news would be all over it. Not a word from the media. Hmmm. Interesting.

Yes it’s a different country. They still have cities with million peoples. I’m sick of the argument that Sweden is not the US.

Flame me if you want. Open everything up. We are just dragging this out. And Masks don’t work.

Here is your fake news
Sweden

b-curtis wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>DTW wrote:</div>
Go back to school. Why?

There is a reason Sweden is not in the news…

Sweden has not closed much of anything and the death rate is really low now. High early yes. Not any more. If Sweden was really really bad, the fake news would be all over it. Not a word from the media. Hmmm. Interesting.

Yes it’s a different country. They still have cities with million peoples. I’m sick of the argument that Sweden is not the US.

Flame me if you want. Open everything up. We are just dragging this out. And Masks don’t work.

Here is your fake news
Sweden

Since I am guessing that DTW won’t actually read that article since it is the lugenpresse. Short version: Sweden has 40% more deaths per capita than America (with much lower comorbitities), 7-12 times more deaths per capita than their neighbors, and their economy is getting killed anyway

I don’t know what the answer is myself. There are kids that will bring the virus home. The have a parent that may work at the nursing home, have underlying conditions, or are immune-compromised due to a battle with cancer. Some kids live with grandparents. Some kids have underlying conditions themselves. Some teachers will be real susceptible.

These schools have the potential to be a huge incubator of the virus. Maybe 2 or 3 days a week of in-school attendance? Maybe some kids need to be in-school and remote learning for others?

I don’t have much hope that kids will be sitting in classrooms during the cold/flu season (winter) in this part of the world. I believe it is hitting in the south so hard right now is that the heat pushes people in doors, and also opening up.

Fish To Escape wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>b-curtis wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>DTW wrote:</div>
Go back to school. Why?

There is a reason Sweden is not in the news…

Sweden has not closed much of anything and the death rate is really low now. High early yes. Not any more. If Sweden was really really bad, the fake news would be all over it. Not a word from the media. Hmmm. Interesting.

Yes it’s a different country. They still have cities with million peoples. I’m sick of the argument that Sweden is not the US.

Flame me if you want. Open everything up. We are just dragging this out. And Masks don’t work.

Here is your fake news
Sweden

Since I am guessing that DTW won’t actually read that article since it is the lugenpresse. Short version: Sweden has 40% more deaths per capita than America (with much lower comorbitities), 7-12 times more deaths per capita than their neighbors, and their economy is getting killed anyway

I am not saying I agree with Sweden’s approach. But with all due respect this COVID experiment is long from over and so any conclusions to the story hasn’t been written yet.

11 million people are in New York too and way more deaths than Sweden but they are doing pretty good now. Is that really from wearing masks?? Wider spread immunity?? Time will tell

Remember, you can flatten the curve but the area under the curve doesn’t chamge. Sweden’s curve could very well end long before ours.

joe-winter wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Fish To Escape wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>b-curtis wrote:</div>

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>DTW wrote:</div>
Go back to school. Why?

There is a reason Sweden is not in the news…

Sweden has not closed much of anything and the death rate is really low now. High early yes. Not any more. If Sweden was really really bad, the fake news would be all over it. Not a word from the media. Hmmm. Interesting.

Yes it’s a different country. They still have cities with million peoples. I’m sick of the argument that Sweden is not the US.

Flame me if you want. Open everything up. We are just dragging this out. And Masks don’t work.

Here is your fake news
Sweden

Since I am guessing that DTW won’t actually read that article since it is the lugenpresse. Short version: Sweden has 40% more deaths per capita than America (with much lower comorbitities), 7-12 times more deaths per capita than their neighbors, and their economy is getting killed anyway

I am not saying I agree with Sweden’s approach. But with all due respect this COVID experiment is long from over and so any conclusions to the story hasn’t been written yet.

11 million people are in New York too and way more deaths than Sweden but they are doing pretty good now. Is that really from wearing masks?? Wider spread immunity?? Time will tell

Remember, you can flatten the curve but the area under the curve doesn’t chamge. Sweden’s curve good very well end long before ours.

Totally agree.

That is true but the whole point of flattening the curve was to get ready for coming increases and to formulate a plan as we learned more about the virus. This has been very poorly executed

I totally understand why we flattened the curve. Poorly executed is such a tough thing to assess. What was the plan again we were trying to execute? Who are we comparing it too? Are we sure we know all the variables of the country/state we are comparing too? 24 hour news cycle that only reports the “low lights”. Constant barrage of how bad we are or how bad half of us are. Kinda hard to see what we are doing right.

I admit to being part of this.

I recently read about some school districts considering staggering attendance, i.e. your kid physically goes to school Mondays and Wednesdays, others Tuesday and Thursdays. The rest of curriculum is taught remote. This seems like an interesting compromise in that it reduces number of kids in classrooms and buses and lunchrooms, yet they get some socialization. However, I think this puts real pressure on teachers to modify and keep track of their class plans, etc. “Teaching online”, effectively, is much different than in the classroom, hybrid even more so, and there aren’t a lot of instructional technologists in K12 to help them. Heck, there aren’t many in higher ed either.

Walleyestudent Andy Cox wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Ice Cap wrote:</div>
Our neighbors home schooled their only daughter from a very early age. Her social skills are entirely inadequate for a 18 year old. she rarely if ever leaves the house, never has any friends over that I can tell.

Last time I actually spoke with her was nearly a year ago and I could tell she was very socially awkward.

Do you know if her social shortcomings are a result of being home schooled or possibly being on the spectrum/autistic?

I don’t know and I’m not saying either way but I do know those that had certain levels of autism that spent their entire education in public schools can still lack many social skills.

They can function fine going about their life, just not in any social situations.

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Charles wrote:</div>
I am sorry its time to get back normal life style.

I’m afraid the “new” normal will never be like the “old” normal.

I can see why you would ask that Andy it would seem plausible but in this case no. As soon as she was born the parents started to isolate her and themselves. We used to do a lot of things with them years ago but they withdrew once she was born. She had a slight bullying incident early in her school life and they pulled her out right away and started the home school online learning.

Since then they have put up fences and gates to their house so you can never tell if they are outside or in the house. We know friends of theirs that haven’t visited them in years because they have simply chosen the isolated lifestyle.

Still friendly when we do happen to see them outside and chat. The parents seem fine but the daughter has certainly suffered for it. And yes the mother and daughter are both on anti depression meds and have been for years.