Lots of people talking about whether the kids should go back to school this fall.
As a father of two small children I think it’s imperative that they do go back to school. Their social and emotional skills are suffering and they desperately need interaction with other children.
Am I missing something? What’s the debate? What do you think?
I don’t have school age children so I personally don’t have any skin in the game at the moment. I don’t think the risk is with the children themselves, its if they catch it and then take it home to their families, relatives, grandparents. The risk of young children getting severely ill from this is documented as extremely remote.
Also, there are a significant portion of adults in schools as teachers, staff, etc. You have to consider their risk too.
It may have to be done on a state-by-state approach.
Retailers are gearing up for “Back To School” sales already. But yes kids need the social interaction both good and bad to learn how to deal with both. That’s always the balance with home schooled kids is to make sure they get the right kind and enough social interaction. Our neighbors home schooled their only daughter from a very early age. Her social skills are entirely inadequate for a 18 year old. she rarely if ever leaves the house, never has any friends over that I can tell.
Last time I actually spoke with her was nearly a year ago and I could tell she was very socially awkward.
The debate is the same as masks. Without sound science people like to make assumptions based on emotion and force others to follow. Lots of petitions out there to prevent kids from going back to school not citing any scientific proof whatsoever.
i feel they should go back. “distant learning” was very tough to do at home with too many distractions
I have a kid starting kindergarten and he wants to go to school and see his friends from pre K, its so hard to do online learning with young kids. Not to mention my wife is going to have to do the online learning and deal with a new born at the same time.
I am sorry its time to get back normal life style.
Certainly a big part of the hesitation is that teachers, staff, and administration are concerned about catching the COVID, perhaps more so than the kids. It’s the same with post-secondary schools – it’s the faculty that may be more susceptible and hesitant.
I have one school age child. I have no idea what the right thing to do is. School is obviously extremely important for kids and having schools closed will be extremely detrimental to kids and the workforce. Looking around the world the countries that have successfully gone back to school did a better job overall of getting levels of virus lower. I don’t see how opening schools won’t lead to increased spread but I don’t see how having schools closed is feasible.
Certainly a big part of the hesitation is that teachers, staff, and administration are concerned about catching the COVID, perhaps more so than the kids. It’s the same with post-secondary schools – it’s the faculty that may be more susceptible and hesitant.
Nice Fella nailed it. My wife is a pre-K teacher, in her 60’s and helping care for both of our mothers who are in their 80’s. Keeping pre-K kids from climbing all over each other, screaming and laughing in each others’ face, etc., is impossible. COVID will spread in classrooms. It may no effect the kids much but bringing it home from school and spreading the virus with either of out mothers is a death sentence. Both have health issues that make them very likely to die if infected. Our situation is not rare, many teachers and staff have similar situations. While I agree that being in school is optimal for most kids, the issues spread far beyond that.
I think it’s imperative that they do go back to school. Their social and emotional skills are suffering and they desperately need interaction with other children.
This! My kids are 10 & 11. Our school failed miserably at the distance learning thing I think they NEED to go to school for the very reasons you listed. Their education was next to nothing while at home. The school provided next to nothing. My FW ended up buying activity books aged for the kids to learn Science, Math, Geography, Spelling etc. The stuff the school sent home was dismal at best. Kids would get up for a morning meeting with there teachers at 8:00AM that lasted only a few minutes. From there they had a 10 problem math work sheet to do online. That’s it! For 2 months, that was it! Not nearly enough in my opinion..
They also need the interactions with their friends and what not at school. We live 4 miles west of town, more or less in the middle of no where. With all the restrictions that we all had to deal with I think the hardest part was not seeing their friends and interacting like kids should do.
As an athletic director and coach, this needs to be handled by the individual states and districts. MPLS public schools should not have the same plans as a school of a few hundred in Northern MN.
My concerns about just blindly reopening:
42% of MN teachers are over the age of 50. It was reported this morning that Edina has ~20 school aged athletes who have tested positive from social interactions and camps. Clearly a wide open school setting with activities and everything else will bring some transmission. Also 96% of districts reported a “drastic shortage” of substitute teachers in the 2019-2020 school year. The logistics of social distancing are not possible in schools. 6′ of space would not be possible in most rooms. Dividing up classes into very small groups is not affordable. Bussing will be a nightmare if CDC guidelines are followed.
My concerns about NOT reopening:
Distance Learning is ineffective for many students. Students with special needs are really going to struggle. The training and infrastructure for this is lacking in many districts. Students’ social and emotional health are fragile. Anything short of school routines are hard on kids of all ages, backgrounds, etc. Many parents cannot afford or find decent daycare or supervision if kids are not in school.
This isn’t a black and white issue with a simple solution or one sided stances being “right”. Administrators are going to have to be creative and proactive. Principals and Superintendents will really have to earn those huge salaries this year.
Risk, it’s everywhere kinda.
Businesses considered as essential, assume same risk as kids in school.
Ask yourself which of these ‘essential business’ are more important than raising a child.
There’s plenty of places that have never stopped operating. I work for one of them. Laughable were essential in comparison to sending kids to school.
There’s a loss happening with kids that stimulus money doesn’t replace. Will have interesting long term implications.
I’d prefer my 16 yo gets to enjoy education and activities to enhance her life.
Vs bars being open or restaurants as an example
If kids had a vote, I wonder what it would be!
i like buckys response. What’s the debate? I think that’s obvious – kids around each other in schools will spread the virus and bring it home to their families who will in turn continue the spread at their place of employment ect ect
I too have young children and although i don’t always agree with the schooling practices with regard to the actual education portion and the nutrition provided i absolutely agree that being social with other kids is of paramount importance to their development socially, emotionally and mentally. School is the best place for this development to take place and without it the kids are suffering. Probably suffering in ways we wont realize until much later.
I read that the WH is campaigning to have schools reopened by this Fall. I am not in the crowd who thinks this virus is another flu, under control, not a risk, incidental. On the other hand i think kids being out of school is difficult on them and damaging to their development and i have concerns about parents not being able to work or manage life at home impacting the economy along with home life.
I don’t know what the answer is but buckys response sounds smart – decisions should be made on a local/district level and needs to be based on that areas factors. It doesn’t make sense for Silver Bay’s model to match up with St. Paul’s and visa-versa
Our neighbors home schooled their only daughter from a very early age. Her social skills are entirely inadequate for a 18 year old. she rarely if ever leaves the house, never has any friends over that I can tell.
Last time I actually spoke with her was nearly a year ago and I could tell she was very socially awkward.
Do you know if her social shortcomings are a result of being home schooled or possibly being on the spectrum/autistic?
I don’t know and I’m not saying either way but I do know those that had certain levels of autism that spent their entire education in public schools can still lack many social skills.
They can function fine going about their life, just not in any social situations.
I am sorry its time to get back normal life style.
I’m afraid the “new” normal will never be like the “old” normal.
My daughter is going to be a Senior this year. I know the distant learning did not go real well for her or a lot of her friends at the end of last year. Both her and I are hoping that they go back to school like normal this Fall. One of the strange things that they did with the distant learning last fall, was giving the kids the choice to either take their Grade and effect their GPA or allow them to take a pass and not effect the GPA. Even if kids got a D in the class they simply took the pass instead of the grade. Needless to say a lot of the kids didn’t put much into their classes and simply took the Pass. I hope that is not allowed this year if they end up doing distant learning.
The risk is worth the reward
67,000 Pediatricians agree.
Kids aren’t “superspreaders” of the virus (very, very few get sick enough to even become contagious)
I’d rather hang out around 50,000 kids in a school than ONE person in a nursing home.
I think as parents, we are all united on how important school is to our children. If we think there is a divide between the “haves” and the “have nots” now. It will be way worse if the distance learning continues.
I believe we dropped the ball with children this summer. they need to be intermixing now before the school year starts. Get though it and spread less indoors during the cold and flu season. They absolutely should have been doing summer activities for this reason alone.
I believe in the St Peter/Mankato area, we have a capable testing capacity if implemented diligently and cooperatively can allow kids back to school.
parent/teacher/student identifies symptoms, immediate removal from classroom to testing site. If postive, the whole class is removed and brought to testing site. held out until tests come back. If negative, resume classroom. All positives will distance learn for 2 weeks and have to have a negative test to return…….something like this. (caveat is that classes do not change throughout the day. elementary style) The plan can’t be ‘we have a positive, close school and test everyone then disinfect the building”. If that is the plan than the kids will most definitely not be at school.
Nothing in life will come with a 100 % (or even close ) safety net. Employees at schools will have to make personal decisions of the risks they are willing to take on. The death rate today in MN for all people who don’t live in LTC is 0.08% (assuming the 10 times actual infections the CDC is saying is true). That does not even take into account comorbidities.
If substitute teachers were already in severe shortage, who’s gonna replace the teachers when they get sick? I have a feeling that there will be a significant amount of teachers in the “older” category that simply won’t go back to their jobs at the moment. Without teachers, children can’t go back to school. And you can’t just throw a sub in, because there aren’t any.
Risk, it’s everywhere kinda.
Businesses considered as essential, assume same risk as kids in school.
Ask yourself which of these ‘essential business’ are more important than raising a child.
There’s plenty of places that have never stopped operating. I work for one of them. Laughable were essential in comparison to sending kids to school.There’s a loss happening with kids that stimulus money doesn’t replace. Will have interesting long term implications.
I’d prefer my 16 yo gets to enjoy education and activities to enhance her life.
Vs bars being open or restaurants as an example
If kids had a vote, I wonder what it would be!
x2. Not to mention many (most?) daycares have stayed open the entire time, and I haven’t heard of rampant Covid spread within any of them. My son’s daycare will report if any teachers have contracted it, and we haven’t gotten one notice yet, thankfully. I wonder how many teachers would change their tune, if the paychecks stopped without reopening the schools? (FYI I’m not anti-teacher, my mom taught her entire career, just asking questions)
B-man wrote “The risk is worth the reward
67,000 Pediatricians agree.
Kids aren’t “superspreaders” of the virus (very, very few get sick enough to even become contagious)
I’d rather hang out around 50,000 kids in a school than ONE person in a nursing home.”
The people who take the biggest risk, teachers and school staff, don’t agree. The NEA and others have stated (summary) that unless safety protocols are sufficient to offer significant protection the risk is too great.
Also, I hope your parents/grandparents are not in nursing homes. Those who are in nursing homes are as important to many as your kids are to you.
This ain’t simple. I agree with Bucky’s analysis.
The people who take the biggest risk, teachers and school staff, don’t agree. The NEA and others have stated (summary) that unless safety protocols are sufficient to offer significant protection the risk is too great.
Also, I hope your parents/grandparents are not in nursing homes. Those who are in nursing homes are as important to many as your kids are to you.
This ain’t simple. I agree with Bucky’s analysis.
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I wasn’t implying that I don’t care about people in nursing homes….. 
I meant that myself and a ton of kids are a very low risk to each other, much lower than I would be to even a single person in a nursing home.
We NEED TO GET KIDS in school.
If you’re an at risk or old teacher, stay home.
It will be challenging, but it can be done.
Even if it means having less qualified teachers for lower elementary grades (like having paras take over k-3) and bumping the existing teachers up a few grade levels.
I’m pretty sure the average stay at home mom is capable of teaching and handling half a kindergarten class. Christ, I could do it (I’d have to leave my weapons at home though) lol
I’m also pretty sure the average second grade teacher is capable of teaching sixth grade, the average sixth grade teacher capable of teaching the eighth grade etc, etc.
75 year old Mrs. Smith can stay-at-home.
What is pretty simple is that kids NEED school.
Regular hand washing every hour. Space desks further apart. Masks when appropriate. Increase cleaning and disinfectant use throughout the day and/ or night. Regular temp checks getting on bus and arrival at school.
And finally, for those teachers who feel the risk is too high take an unpaid leave and job waiting for you when you are ready to return.
I’m pretty sure the average stay at home mom is capable of teaching and handling half a kindergarten class. Christ, I could do it (I’d have to leave my weapons at home though) lol
I’m also pretty sure the average second grade teacher is capable of teaching sixth grade, the average sixth grade teacher capable of teaching the eighth grade etc, etc.
75 year old Mrs. Smith can stay-at-home.
An issue with this idea is that many elementary school teachers (my wife included) only have a certification for grade levels K-6, so the amount of jockeying that they would be able to do is limited. Also, I would pump the breaks on the “anyone can teach” mantra. My wife teaches 4th grade, and based on the amount of phone calls she received from parents that were either complaining about the amount of work being sent home (MINIMAL compared to non-quarantine life) or panicking because they couldn’t figure out how to help their child I would say that most parents aren’t cut out to teach for any significant period of time.
That being said, my wife and many of her coworkers are ready to be back in the classroom. The efficiency of teaching remotely wasn’t even in the same ballpark as what they are able to accomplish in the classroom, and this was really disappointing for the teachers that care about their job (and the kids).
Also, I would pump the breaks on the “anyone can teach” mantra.
Ya we definitely can’t throw Hobo Joe into a classroom and expect him to teach a bunch of elementary kids. These are specialized positions, just like anything else.
Also, I hope your parents/grandparents are not in nursing homes. Those who are in nursing homes are as important to many as your kids are to you.
My girls will be going into 5th and 7th grade this year.. We want to see the schools open and kids in school.
Brad, I attached your quote and you do have a valid point.. My issue is this.
We understand that our elders and population with underlying conditions are at high risk. There is a small chance that this virus could pull them over the waterfall. Whats important to understand is that we use the words “risk” and “chance”. Not to debate the #’s because there are many different numbers use. Lets just say they give us numbers like 8% over the age of 75 years old will die. Or 6% of people with underlying conditions can die from this virus. I do not know the exact numbers but it is a small piece of the population that are at “risk” of dying to begin with. By putting kids in school we assume this is going to start killing old people and individuals with underlying conditions????
On the flip side 100% of our younger generation is being affected by this. I understand the difference between death and getting no education/school but every kid here in our school district is being affected and we are putting them at “risk” as well. This is not debatable. Only thing we can debate is how much risk we are putting in our future generation by keeping them out of school, away from socializing and remembering how to be kids. Some of my best memories of my life were from athletics in school and growing up with my friends. Kept me out of trouble as well. I dont want the kids to miss this part again this fall.
Were taking this away from them because were worried about risking others already at risk. Not fair if you ask me…….
It is not just about the ability to teach – it is about the ability to teach your own kids in a weird, forced environment. I have previously been a kindergarten teaching asistant, have taught 7th and 8th graders, and have taught undergrad courses. I was far more effective at each if those compared to “distance learning” my 1st grader.
My kid tested above average in kindergarten academically, but struggles a little with the behavioral structure of a classroom. If they continue this distance stuff I would strongly consider looking into just holding him back because he simply is not getting the proper developmental tasks sitting in front of a chrome book.
Instead of telling vulnerable people to pound sand, perhaps we could offer a two part solution.
I suspect that some parents will want to continue to keep their children out of school. Maybe the kid is sick, or they have a high risk parent, or live in a multi-generational household. Who knows, but some would likely prefer they be home.
So have the at-risk teachers continue to develop a better online curriculum, and then they can teach online in the fall. The teachers, kids, and parents that want to be in school can be. When we come up with an effective therapy, then re-integrate it.
What is pretty simple is that kids NEED school.
Regular hand washing every hour. Space desks further apart. Masks when appropriate. Increase cleaning and disinfectant use throughout the day and/ or night. Regular temp checks getting on bus and arrival at school.
And finally, for those teachers who feel the risk is too high take an unpaid leave and job waiting for you when you are ready to return.
Most of the desks in our district are wall to wall in rooms(25-30 kids). Remodeling isn’t in the budget.
What’s the best way to take temperatures of ~1000 kids in the 25 minute window that most arrive before the day starts (and keeping them socially distant while they wait)?
Where do the funds come from to hire janitorial staff at twice the number of hours currently contracted? A building with each wing being 10s of thousands of sq feet doesn’t disinfect itself during the day or at night.
I’m not picking apart your ideas to Target them as bad. I’m sure lots of districts may implement some of those ideas. However, it’s not nearly as simple as anyone makes it out to be. Putting plans into action that have never been attempted before isn’t easy.
I coach football. What are the IDO thoughts on our season happening? RCTC just cancelled all fall sports a day or two ago.
Instead of telling vulnerable people to pound sand, perhaps we could offer a two part solution.
I suspect that some parents will want to continue to keep their children out of school. Maybe the kid is sick, or they have a high risk parent, or live in a multi-generational household. Who knows, but some would likely prefer they be home.
So have the at-risk teachers continue to develop a better online curriculum, and then they can teach online in the fall. The teachers, kids, and parents that want to be in school can be. When we come up with an effective therapy, then re-integrate it.
Sorry to quote myself, but it also occurred to me that having this model in place would allow any kids who did test positive and needed to be quarantined to do online learning if they’re healthy enough.
I think fall sports are pretty unlikely.
Ivy League has already cancelled all fall sports.
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