.300 Win Mag vs 300 Weatherby Mag

I am beginning to look at future trips that will require a little more firepower than I currently possess. I am thinking that a “fast 30” is almost certainly the way I want to go due to the performance and the vast selection in bullet types and weights.

What is not so clear to me is which “fast 30” is the way to go. Let me state first what does NOT matter to me. Again, these are things that DON’T MATTER to this discussion:

– I don’t care about factory ammo availability or selection. I handload 100% of my own ammo.
– Gun brand doesn’t matter. To avoid a Ford vs Chevy debate, let’s stipulate that the rifle I have selected is available in both chamberings. The rifle will be a JP Sauer, Weatherby, or Sako.

So what it comes down to to me is .300 Win Mag vs 300 Weatherby. The performance difference is only a little, but almost across the board it is biased in favor of the Weatherby.

Recoil is what I’m not sure about. Most objective info I can find seems to indicate that the Wby kicks harder, but what I can’t find is how much harder is “harder”? Is this significant.

I am somewhat reluctant to add a brake to this rifle because one destination may be Africa and plains game where braked rifles have a reputation for splitting the eardrums and dusting the faces of your PH and stalking party and seem to be frowned upon in the extreme in some camps. If it’s braked at all, it will have to be removeable. And I’ll have to feel comfortable shooting it in both conditions.

I would consider alternative, but right off the bat I’ll say that the 300 RUM is off the table because I don’t buy Remington rifles and it is not available in the rifles that I’ve narrowed the search to.

I need to be able to throw at least up to 220 grain bullets and the “standard” fare will be 180-200 class bullets. I do not care about “long range” potential, I know my limits and with a 30 that’s going to be inside 400.

Win Mag vs Weatherby. Any thoughts?

Grouse

Personally I would go with a Win mag. The Weatherby (aside from the initial cost of brass and dies which is much higher) kicks like a mule. I have shot both and the Weatherby for a little bit more performance is not friendly to me.
Granted both were in ultra lights. Which again never recommend for anyone.

I like win mag because if you get in a bind it is more normal round. Off the shelf ammo is available. Both have some serious choices for bullets but brass with the Weatherby are you still limited to Weatherby brass?

Win you have a few more choices.

Excellent feedback and very much what I’m interested in hearing about re the recoil levels of both.

Regarding the ammo situation, it’s very difficult to imagine where this would come up, but yes it could happen that the ammo supply goes missing on a trip. Granted, 300 Wby is not impossible to find as that’s the most common Weatherby chambering in production, but point taken.

In the Weatherby’s favor, I have to confess, it that to me it’s just more interesting. Yes, yes, I know. Grouse, you shallow fashion victim! I can’t escape it, though, there’s just something cooler about uncasing a Weatherby in camp, and it cannot be denied.

Grouse

I’d go with a .300 WBY! Everybody has a .300 Win. I had a .257 WBY and it was a beautiful shooting caliber, love the Weatherby calibers. I didn’t reload at the time, wish I would have kept it!

Ben

Ben Brettingen wrote:

I’d go with a .300 WBY! Everybody has a .300 Win. I had a .257 WBY and it was a beautiful shooting caliber, love the Weatherby calibers. I didn’t reload at the time, wish I would have kept it!

Ben

And now the crowd will hurl insults at Brettingen the Hunting Fashion Victim.

“Brettingen, you Weatherby-shooting, Sitka-wearing, VLD bullet loving, Range Rover driving… Your mother probably shoots a Creedmore!”

Grouse

I have to say, it seems to me that your real question is pretty simple: “I want to buy a 300 Weatherby. Will it kick a whole lot harder than the win mag? As in, enough harder that I’ll wish I had bought the win mag?”

My advice, for what it’s worth, if your personal satisfaction is the real objective: Don’t buy a win mag unless you shoot both to compare and end up feeling very confident about your decision.

I don’t know if it’s quite that simple, John. Yes, recoil at and above “the .30 line” IS a consideration.

With that said, having shot a .300, .338, .375 and even a 416 (once!), I’m wondering if there’s enough of a difference between the 300s to, umm, really make any difference? Especially if not going with a superlight “mountain” rifle, which I won’t be doing.

I’m also interested to see if anyone has any comments about the fact that a .300 Weatherby would most likely be in a Weatherby rifle. What is a modern Weatherby rifle like nowadays? The last Weatherby I shot was a 270 WBY Mark V from the 1970s, I believe.

JP Sauer and Sako are, to my mind, both are very, very, very good rifles. In the modern era, I just have not encountered anyone who owns these brands who has had a bad experience or got a rifle that wouldn’t shoot the lights out. So I would be very confident with a Sauer or Sako, but these would be in Win Mag. I’m not sure how the current Weatherby stacks up to these and oddly enough the Weatherby is the only option that could go both ways.

Grouse

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

“Brettingen, you Weatherby-shooting, Sitka-wearing, VLD bullet loving, Range Rover driving… Your mother probably shoots a Creedmore!”

Yeah yeah yeah! I also have a .300 win mag! Nobody told you? You’re not cool unless you have a 6.5 Creedmore….best thing since sliced bread!

I haven’t shot a 300 bee but I do have the new 6.5-300 bee in the new Mark V accumark. It’s lights out and does have a nice bark to it when it fires. It’s hard to beat a Weatherby rifle. The trigger is so smooth when letting rounds fly. I’d send you to the weatherby forum but that’s a little biased. The new Mark V rifles are some of the best out there. If you’re hand loading id go with the bee. There are a few videos out on YouTube of guys shooting the 300, check them out.

All I can say Grouse is that the only Weatherby I own, a Lazerguard, has been flawless and amazing right out of the box. If all Vanguard 2 models are made like this, they’re outperforming the Tikkas. Therefore, I’m inclined to believe that the higher models should be equally competitive with anything else that’s out there. As for which round to choose, follow your gut. Flip a coin and see which one wins, then determine how that outcome makes you feel. That’ll tell you all you need to know.

I’ve got friends that have both calibers. As you stated, they are very close in over all performance. Looks like the weatherby picks up on average about 150fps faster with a lessor charge.

The Weatherby has a radius on the neck of the brass in lieu of a typical angle press. I would investigate the advantages/disadvantages of the brass on reloads

My buddy and I each purchased weatherby ultra lite stainless with factory breaks. His 300 weatherby mag and me 300 win. Shot both guns at the range lots of times. Didn’t care for the weatherby mag, extremely loud and with the break off kicked like a mule. Both were very accurate. Still have my 257 mag it is my favorite gun.

realtreeap10 wrote:

I haven’t shot a 300 bee but I do have the new 6.5-300 bee in the new Mark V accumark. It’s lights out and does have a nice bark to it when it fires. It’s hard to beat a Weatherby rifle. The trigger is so smooth when letting rounds fly. I’d send you to the weatherby forum but that’s a little biased. The new Mark V rifles are some of the best out there. If you’re hand loading id go with the bee. There are a few videos out on YouTube of guys shooting the 300, check them out.

RealTree how is the accuracy and ballistics on that so far? I am pretty intrigued with that caliber.

I agree, the 6.5 MM was ripe for the Weatherby treatment and the 6.5-3000 is a very interesting development, flat and fast!

Grouse

I’ve only put a few rounds down range as I’m waiting for them to get the 140 swift Aframes to break in the barrel. So far the rounds I’ve put down have been under 1 MOA with a few flyers getting used to it. I don’t have a chronograph so I haven’t compared fps to what they advertise. Seen a few videos of guys shooting it 1,000 yds and hitting the plate on their first try.

Do you actually think that in a real life hunting situation after firing your chosen chambering you would say you wished you had the other?

I have shot my stepbrothers .300 win mag and it is a great round. The kick is not as bad as some people would make you think. Its all about how often you shoot, having good form ect. that being said I would not want to shoot 20+ rounds through it without a benchrest or shooting from prone. I do not know much about the weatherby i have not shot it.
But i think youre selling yourself short grouse. a little bit more money invested in a nice piece of glass and you could really have some 500+ yard fun with that caliber. especially with those premium handloads.

I’m with you Carter, I have shot the .300 Win Mag and the shorty version as well. I would not characterize the recoil as “bad”, in fact to be honest I don’t think it’s that much worse than a hotter .30-06 load.

So that got me wondering because I often read comments about the 300 Weatherby often include a comment about heavy recoil. Which gets me thinking, dang, given the performance difference between the two is pretty slim (slight edge to Weatherby) then why do so many talk about how the Weatherby kicks like a mule?

The biggest drawback to the Weatherby is that while everyone makes a .300 Win Mag, well, Weatherby tends to be made mostly by… ummm…Weatherby. There are exceptions, but they are thin on the ground and some of the best known are also not in current production.

I don’t know if anyone out there has seen the new Sauer (JP Sauer, not SIG Sauer) Model 100? This rifle was on the rollout tour at this year’s shows and I handled one (and handled it, and handled it some more) at the SCI show this past winter. Wow.

You know all that stuff they say about the Germans being all about the engineering and being really anal-retentive about little details? Well that would be blatant stereotyping except for the fact that it’s true.

Pull back the bolt handle on your Ruger American or, basically any other bolt action production rifle. Now shake the rifle. Hear that rattle of the bolt? Sauer’s, including the 100, do NOT rattle. At all. The bolt to action fit is so precise. The detachable magazine locks in place with a solid “snick” like a safe door closing, not a click or a snap, or a ping or a ting. Pretty amazing engineering.

Well, needless to say that’s the leading contender and it doesn’t come in Weatherby.

Grouse

I shoot the 300 WBY, I use this rifle for everything whitetail size and larger, my”go to”gun.I also reload and went through this selection process years ago, and that little bit extra performance swayed me to the WBY.
Once brass is purchased, they are bout the exact cost to reload, tish more powder in WBY.As far as recoil, mine is not bad at all, I have a single shot 20 gauge that “kicks”harder.I shoot a pretty stout load 180 grn tsx and 84.5 grn reloader 22 yields 3280 fps.
Personally I would never install a muzzle break on any of my rifles, Im almost deaf the way it is!!
Either is a good choice in my opinion and recoil is going to vary from rifle to rifle.My rifle is a weatherby, not an expensive one, a vangaurd stainless synthetic, but shoots very well, especially with above mentioned load.

BTW – on the Weatherby. The Mark V action is built by Atek in Brainard, MN and the Vanguard action is the Howa action

If it fits your budget you could always get the 300 you want and suppress it, then you would have recoil and noise control making it easier on the shooter.

JH

I wish we could ditch the mindset and laws left over from the last century when it comes to America’s government attitudes about suppressors, but until that happens I’m just not willing to go through the hoop jumping exercise. I just don’t have the time for the hassle factor and to be honest I resent having to play the outdated game for what in most of the civilized world is simply a normal, over the counter, purchase.

Slow progress is being made to correct the retarded attitude that our politicians had toward suppressors, but I’m not going to play the game and contribute any money and time toward maintaining the ridiculous status quo.

Grouse

I’ve had the occasion to shoot the 300 Wsm and the standard 300 Winnie. I have shot the 300 Wby and a 340 Wby. There is some noticeable difference in recoil between the standard 300 and the Wby. Not enough to get all nerved up about though. The 340…..now that’s a tooth rattler even with the brake. If I were in the shopping market for a 300 I’d do the Wby because you can always load down to soften things up some and not all game requires a cannon, but its hard to stretch a caliber like the 300 Winnie to do more and the Wby has more from the get go.

I am thinking about this caliber of rifle. I want either a Sako or Weatherby. In either brand which model would you choose. Haven’t made up my mind about 300 Wby or Wsm. I like the looks of the Arroyo in Weatherby. Hal

As far as caliber you might see a difference of about 300fps between the 300 wby,win mag,and wsm.The wby is an expensive rd to buy,the win mag will probly be easiest to find,and all things being eqaul the wsm normally has less felt recoil.
You cant really go wrong with any,as a handloader I took the wby for the extra fps,and those 30 cal’s seems to have an endless selection of bullets to choose from!!

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

I’m also interested to see if anyone has any comments about the fact that a .300 Weatherby would most likely be in a Weatherby rifle. What is a modern Weatherby rifle like nowadays? The last Weatherby I shot was a 270 WBY Mark V from the 1970s, I believe.

Grouse

I thought you wanted to keep brand comments out of this thread?
“– Gun brand doesn’t matter. To avoid a Ford vs Chevy debate, let’s stipulate that the rifle I have selected is available in both chamberings. The rifle will be a JP Sauer, Weatherby, or Sako.”

I have no input as I have never shot either of those calibers, I just came here to read…

CaptainMusky wrote:

I thought you wanted to keep brand comments out of this thread?

What I meant is that I wanted comments on the two chamberings being discussed and (as relevant) the rifles outlined. I was looking to avoid generic “buy a Brand X” comments without any link to the chamberings outlined.

Obviously, since short of a total custom job, a 300 Weatherby is most likely going to come from Weatherby, I’d like to know if they are what they were?

The NEWEST Weatherby I’ve personally shot was a late 1970s or early 1980s vintage Mark 5. The quality was very good, as I recall, but it was not light. A lot of water has passed under the Weatherby bridge since then.

But since I started this thread, the 6.5-3000 introduction has had Weatherby rifles in every hunting magazine almost worldwide. Comments about the rifles have been favorable as well.

Must say it’s nice to see Weatherby turning the corner where so many have gone down the road of being just a brand.

Grouse

Gun weight and stock dimensions will play a large part in felt recoil, too. As for weight, where are you planning to hunt this weapon? The full sized mags will weight more than say a short mag in 300 and if memory serves me well the Weatherby was the heavy gun. If you’re going to be on foot in a mountain scenario the Winnie will be friendlier to carry because it will likely weigh less, the short mag even moreso…..unless of course you opt for a Weatherby rifle chambered in .300 Winnie or short mag.

Another consideration is availability of ammo. Not every shop will offer the Weatherby fodder. The .300 Winchester is a Kmart and Walmart caliber. Cost is another factor. Just for giggles I went to Cabelas site and checked on the cost of ammo. Weatherby ammo will set you back anywhere from $62.00/box of 20 to $85.00/ 20. The short mag in 300 will take %38.00 or so bucks from your coffers. The 300 Winnie is probably the easiest to find and the cost for a 20 round box is around $24.00. The Weatherby chow ain’t cheap, so reloading will almost be required.

If it were my decision to make right now before I bought into the Weatherby I’d be studying the new Nosler calibers and cartridges and guns…..they’re on line with Weatherby in almost all aspects right down to recoil. Weatherby isn’t the only company turning corners today.

I have shot the 300 wby and the recoil was not pleasant. A chart of recoil I found on the internet said 180 grn 300 win 25.9 ft lbs of recoil, 180 grn 300 wby 31.6 ft lbs, for comparison 7mm rem 175 grn 21.7 ft lbs. I have owned and shot the 7mm and a friends 375 h&H it was to heavy of recoil for me personally 37 ft lbs. IMHO recoil is all related to holding technique and gun fit. . My 7mag was a Sako Finnebear hunter and was a tackdriver out of the box . Also remeber that most turkey and goose loads in shotguns can be double the recoil of a 300 wby

Mwal

My big bopper is a 338WM in a Sako Finnbear. I was gonna go 300WM, but I like the bigger hole and the 250 Partitions just seem like the bee’s knees for anything big I want dead. Of the two you mentioned, I’d take the 300WM and load up some good quality 180 grain hunting bullets and go to work.